Second Life Sued. Again. You Should Pay Attention This Time.

A lawsuit was filed yesterday against Linden Lab, Second Life developers, for essentially having poor customer service.

Specifically, two of the most well-known merchants within SL, Munchflower Zaius (Shannon Grei), who runs a boutique (pics within NSFW) that sells gothic-oriented skins and clothing, and Stroker Serpentine (Kevin Alderman), who sells, um, a lot of sex toys, complain that Linden Lab’s procedures for protecting merchants within SL against theft are failures, and it results in lost business. Which becomes srs bizness when you realize that Alderman has sold over $1 million worth of cybersex animations. Alderman’s view on the subject (as quoted by Massively):

When public service announcements and nudity both fail, bring in the lawyers

Our intent is not to take down Second Life, nor create a division amongst the community. It is apparent to many of us that our concerns have gone largely ignored. Copybot, Builderbot, CryoLife [content theft exploits] et al are but symptoms of an ambivalent approach towards IP theft on behalf of Linden Lab. For years we have been promised better tools, more metadata, sticky licenses, aggressive response, verification, watermarks … ad nauseum. Seven years later and all we are given is a ‘Roadmap’.

The pirates know full well how to hedge their bets and leverage the DMCA in their favor. We are virtually defenseless unless we have the financial means to pursue expensive litigation. We do not expect miracles. We understand the nature of our chosen environment. Unfortunately, there is little to no deterrence under the current regime.

The wording here is important, since this lawsuit is essentially a political act. Alderman and Grei, both well-known community leaders within SL, have said, in the most direct way possible, that the community they are a part of is run so badly, legal redress is needed. Alderman even refers to the “regime”, as if the current governance of Linden Lab is something that is temporary and replaceable.

Like many lawsuits involving MMOs, this essentially says “You didn’t pay attention to us. PAY ATTENTION NOW.” In this case, the real problem is that Linden Lab is essentially being targeted for not investing enough on a police force and effective governance. This traditionally is not something that MMOs worry about, save at the last minute and with the least expense. Yet in such an environment, content creators, feeling million-dollar markets at risk, are threatened that they will be put out of business by exploits they have no power to combat. Alderman in particular has been aggressive about responding to these via the legal system (Grei joining him in the second suit), and this suit is the ultimate expression of that. There is also the not insignificant matter of Linden Lab profiting from Grei and Alderman’s work directly, through server rentals and commissions on advertising and direct sales – while also profiting from pirates who then turn around and resell their work through the same tools that Grei and Alderman use. So from a simple customer service standpoint, the solution would seem obvious – spend more money on customer service dedicated to copyright theft (which will be a thankless task) and develop tools that automate already extant procedures to address theft complaints. Simple, though painful since both will involve investment in profit sinks, not profit centers (thusly, refer back to MMOs worrying about this at the last minute and the least expense).

Yet there is another problem, and that is the political, not merely the technological. Alderman and Grei, by insisting that Linden Lab benefited from theft of their work and should be held accountable, are denying Linden Lab’s status as a neutral host of content. Given Second Life’s status as the most freewheeling, open and libertarian virtual world, that seems a dangerous assertion to press. Holding Linden Lab legally responsible for all the various misdeeds of its denizens means that Linden Lab, if sane, will promptly cut back its liability as quickly as possible.

Which, not to put a fine a point on things, will mean that there will no longer be a $1 million market for cybersex animations.

http://www,damnedvulpine.com/ J.

Well. If this is what it finally takes to put LLabs out of business, I can think of no better way to swing that phallic cudgel.
Larry Lard

> Munchflower Zaius (Shannon Grei) … and Stroker Serpentine (Kevin Alderman)

I love American names… it was only after the second one I knew that this was ‘Real Name (SL Name)’
http://dsob.wordpress.com geldonyetich

“Hello, my name is Linden Labs. I would like to open an online environment where you can use the provided tools to create artifacts that you can sell for my in-game currency which is incidentally can be converted to cold, hard, cash.”

“Pleased to meet you, I am your average Second Life content creator. I am now very motivated to spend time in your otherwise completely meaningless online environment by the promise of said cold, hard cash. After some experimentation, I have determined that your environment is mostly occupied by a wide variety of sexual deviants who have found your virtual backdrop to be ideal to enact their twisted fantasies, and am now producing content to match.”

“How interesting. While we do see what’s wrong with that, we do not see what’s wrong with accepting your money. Therefore we shall sweep you under the carpet and try to have as little to do with you as possible while still allowing you to virtually whore yourself out as you and your ilk steadily take over our environment. Users will be users, after all.”

“Hello? Linden Labs? I find it very vexing that the deviants who play our game have found a means to access my content without paying me. After all, I put a lot of work into repurposing this content off the Internet.”

“I see. While we do appreciate the irony of your situation, the very reason Second Life is so very exploitable in this fashion is for the some reason you were able to perform said repurposing of Internet content to begin with. Simply by virtue of it being something that has to be deplayed on anyone’s computers, it can be dulicated without their conscent. Therefore, I regret to inform you that Cyberspace is working as intended.”

“Well, I would like to remind you that, like the pornographers on the Internet we borrow from, we are producing this content for cold, hard cash. Therefore, we are doing to you what they would do to us if they could find us: sueing. Oh, but please don’t stop monetarily incentivizing us to monetarily punish you.”

“It seems this farce has reached its inevitable conclusion. We shall now be absconding with your money and shutting down our service. Good day.”

“Wait – what?”
Informis

That ad gives me a very serious case of the willies.

To whoever thinks that guy looks cool: YOU ARE WRONG.
Chas

I’ll ignore the “virtual proprty” arguments here, as they can largely be sidestepped. The biggest issue is going to be whether casual developer statements (“promises” of better tools, more metadata, sticky licenses, aggressive response, verification, watermarks) should be seen as binding and deceptive?

Building a business in any environment involves assessing the risks of that environment. If the environment offers poor or limited Rights Management, and that’s known, then you’ve accepted that risk. If you’ve been deceived (not just carelessly blind to the fact, but intentionally misled) into thinking the environment’s rights management is more robust (or will be ‘soon’) then Munchflower & Stroker might have a case.
http://stabbedup.blogspot.com/ Stabs

“That ad gives me a very serious case of the willies.

To whoever thinks that guy looks cool: YOU ARE WRONG.”

Ha ha, classic comment. You DO know what a willy is to us Brits, right?
dartwick

I hope the merchants loose. I suspect they will.
http://dsob.wordpress.com geldonyetich

@dartwick
Oh, they’re loose, alright.
Coyote Momiji (G. R. Crisp)

Disclaimer: Friend of Munchflower and I know Stroker.

“Holding Linden Lab legally responsible for all the various misdeeds of its denizens”

I disagree, to be honest. I think this is holding LL responsible for making promises and failing repeatedly to deliver upon them.

LL has, for years, proclaimed themselves as interested in copyright protection for the users and merchants on the grid, but have proven themselves disinterested in dealing with the hard reality of what such a proclamation entails – the willingness to back it up with force and prevent known content rippers from repeating the act over, and over.

I don’t know. I am hoping that if nothing else, this shakes LL up a bit, makes them take the DMCA claims that flood their office seriously, and maybe start to put their money where their mouth is.

… Doubt it, though.
http://www.psychochild.org/ Brian ‘Psychochild’ Green

As I’ve said before, people need to be careful about suing developers like this. At some point it’s going to be easier to just shut the thing down than try to run without too many laws and regulations. Biting the hand that gives you a million dollars, indeed.

On the other hand, this does bring up an interesting issue of developer statements and user expectations. If a developer says they think something is a good idea (e.g. Necromancy), does that become a promise? In the realm of business, does an utterance become binding if someone develops their business around it? Really makes one think twice about how transparent the inner workings should be given that many concepts don’t see the light of day.
Cindy Claveau

For those of you who do not subscribe to Second Life, please remember that it is as different from other virtual worlds and games as can be – Linden Lab granted residents IP rights back in 2003, so that anything we create in world is, technically, our property. What they failed to foresee, however, was the human tendency to lie, cheat and steal and have never been very aggressive about pursuing trademark infringements OR IP theft. That’s what this suit is about.

And, Lum, I’ll take exception to your bit about “neutral service provider”. Linden Lab left the “neutral” bit behind years ago when they banned gambling, banned ageplay, and then built Zindra to force adult activities behind a wall. They’re no longer “neutral” in any sense of the word, and this suit is liable to force them to rethink this silly idea that preventing IP theft is all up to the consumer. It isn’t, not when LL holds the keys to the servers and databases.

I’m hopeful that the suit puts an end to this “neutral” notion and forces LL to take a more proactive role in preventing legal infringements of trademarks and IP property. Right now, SL is a wasteland of ripoffs and bandits.
http://word-of-shadow.blogspot.com Melf_Himself

Exactly – this is one of the many reasons why in most other MMO’s you do not get to own any of the IP created with the game.
Alex

He’s taken in over a million dollars selling products with no manufacturing cost; I highly doubt that piracy is taking the clothes off his back.
http://mmomisanthrope.wordpress.com/ Dblade

It depends if it’s even possible for them to aggressively guard IP. Reminds me of trying to take on RMT in regular games. Usually the cost of preventing RMT is greater than the benefit of them being gone. I would think LL has done much because it’s probably impossible for them to do so in any financially realistic sense.

I forsee the suit being dropped as a settlement is made, and LL quietly reworking some of the legalese to prevent it happening again.
faefrost

Does anyone else suspect that some poor elderly judge, who barely knows how to check his AOL e-mail is gonna land this particular litiganous gem? He’s goin to take one look at this freak show and order all parties involved to be taken out behind the courthouse and horsewhipped…
Neil

Que Prokofy Neva 300+ comment thread in 3…2…
Neil

Cue*

I fail at spelling.
John Arras

This is so sad. There is no way LL can police this effectively and still make money due to the high costs of human CS intervention.

Copyright lets you restrict how people can copy, distribute, modify and present information that you’ve created.

Computers are machines that let you copy, distribute, modify and present huge amounts of arbitrary information.

Anything they can do can be described in these terms. Therefore, computers are machines that break copyright.

Therefore all techniques designed to automatically protect copyright (DRM) will fail as long as computers exist.

However, in the US, copyright only exists to promote the progress of the useful arts and sciences, and since the widespread existence of computing power promotes the progress of science, if we have to make a choice between the arts and sciences, and I choose science.

Copyright has to become something people adhere to because it’s the honorable thing to do because it’s hard to arrange bits correctly, not becuase we can enforce it with technology. I support a fee on storage media (or something like that), but I don’t know how to distribute these fees equitably.

I don’t enjoy this fact since I make my living arranging bits.
http://stabbedup.blogspot.com/ Stabs

Some strange ideas on copyright there.

Historically copyright came about because there wasn’t much point writing books if people would just print rip-off copies and not send the author any money. The term “useful arts” was coined when copyright law was added to the US Constitution and is a very vague term. It could be argued that virtual sex toys are “useful arts” within the context of the law.

But the reality has changed considerably since the Statute of Anne was passed “for the encouragement of learned men to compose and write useful books.”

Now copyright is primarily for the people and companies who own it to make money. It lasts far longer than the original term of 14 years. And I think people adhere to it not out of honour but because they don’t want to get caught and punished.

How much honour does an online pornographer deserve anyway?

And how much respect for copyright does the games industry in general show. For example, with regard to JRR Tolkien’s copyright on orcs (which expires at the end of 2043)?
Imp

geldonyetich,

As a SL content creator I find you implication that most content is regurgitated cut and paste from the internet very insulting, as well as saying most users are sexual deviants. and that we whore ourselves.

I take pride in my creations and don’t need to (and don’t) steal anything from anyone, believe it or not some people actually have creative talent. I make things I like, if others enjoy them and buy them great, But that is hardly whoring myself out.

I find it very satisfying that people like my work enough that they are willing to pay me for it. And last I checked being paid for your work isn’t unethical.

For years I’ve done game modding as a hobby, I enjoy it and appreciate the feed back when people like what I’ve created.

When I 1st discovered SL and what was possible, and that I could just jump in with little investment and some talent and could try my hand at being a merchant, I was simply in awe, it was the greatest thing ever (ok a bit exaggerated lol). It was a rush when I was able to make a descent amount of change from my creations, that people actually liked them that much.

So when someone comes along and try’s to paint that as something unsavory it pisses me off.

It would be like me claiming most game bloggers just copy and paste content from game news sites and pander to their fanbois.

Just like anything on the internet, there is a significant amount of deviance (search for anything with the slightest sexual connotation on Google with safe search off) the only difference is on the internet at large, you can’t see that the people around you are deviants.

Do you know how many of your fellow posters on here are deviants? Of coarse not, unless they raise there hand and say “hey, I’m a perv!” You have no way of knowing they came here right after they visited their favorite porn site.
It’s just hard to miss in SL when they are standing their next to you.
Imp

Why is it that your typos/spelling errors insist on remaining invisible until after to hit post lol
Gx1080

Um, you are suing because LL isn’t protecting your money source. And given the fact that, well, Second Life community biggest authority it’s the feelings between their legs, I personally want to see the face of a judge and a jury when your “merchandise” it’s shown as evidence.

And also, If you makes hosting Second Life servers unprofitable for the conditions that you want to force to Linden Labs, they are going to close shop.

In other note, please don’t tell me that people are complaining because Linden Labs doesn’t support pedophiles and want to put 18+ content in a non-visible place. You know, like any regular person.
Tremayne

Seems to me that Linden Labs have a case to answer just because they’ve touted SL as a virtual place you can do real business in. Running an in-world business dealing in SL artifacts is very arguably one of the major reasons people pay Linden for their services – and hence, if Linden aren’t taking reasonable measures to allow those in-world businesses to run then they are failing to make their service fit for the intended purpose.

The key word, of course, is “reasonable”. Linden will no doubt that they’re making an appropriate effort to deal with virtual counterfeiting, Grei and Alderman are contending that that they aren’t.
Cindy Claveau

@Gx1080: Obviously you know enough about Second Life to make an ass of yourself trying to comment.

1. As I noted in my other comment, LL has already been aggressive about banning ageplay.
2. How can you have pedophilia on a service where minimum age is 18?
3. If you think judges are going to flinch serving a decision, you haven’t been paying attention. Like this, same plaintiff, same issue, even cited in the current suit. Stroker won: http://virtuallyblind.com/2007/12/03/kenzo-simon-settlement/

@Stabs: This suit is as much about trademark infringement as it is about copyright. Both are legally protected, and both are at issue. Stroker has filed complaints about a number of imitators who tried to steal his trademark with inferior products. And both he and Grei cite the patents and copyrights they already have which have been infringed. As for your dismissive comment about “honor”, Stroker is not a pornographer. He sells virtual sex aids.

I’m thinking there’s more misinformation in these comments than there was in Lum’s original article.
Shann

I’m agreeing with John about the whole copying thing. Just how do they expect LL to prevent people using computers to copy things? How would they even have the manpower to ever do that, how would anyone even afford policing tens of thousands of people on the Internet?
These people are probably making more than the average Second Life user, and they’re still complaining that they had the opportunity to become millionaires by using the very same platform? If they win their case, will they still be allowed in Second Life? They’re complaining about losing money, but this may cost them the possibility of making more, along with many other LL users. If I made enough money to fill my gas tank I’d be thankful. I think this may be a can of worms they might regret opening when all is said and done.
JuJutsu

To whoever thinks that guy looks cool: YOU ARE WRONG.

You have something against microcephalics?

Right now, SL is a wasteland of ripoffs and bandits.

That’s a dramatic improvement.
Cindy Claveau

Shann: I’ve been doing some digging and I’ve found ideas for solutions which have been put forth for at least 5 years now, none of which were adopted. In 2003, LL was talking about a “Creative Commons License” system. In 2007, a content creator’s guild in SL started suggesting that LL embed codes in uploaded textures and scripts to make it easy to track theft. It’s also been suggested many times that non-verified individuals not be allowed to upload textures or run businesses (if you want to do business, register with LL). None of these ideas are perfect, but then again none of them have even been tried. LL has dismissed all of them out of hand.

I’m not buying the notion that, because the plaintiffs have made money in SL that they have no right to complain. This is about right vs. wrong — if you work hard and build a business that employs dozens of other people as Stroker has done, the “wrong” is when someone else tries to make money off your ideas and steals what you worked to build and test. That’s what makes me believe this suit is much more about forcing LL to implement anti-theft measures than it is about winning a lot of money. A solution will last a lot longer than a barrel of cash here.
JuJutsu

…Stroker is not a pornographer. He sells virtual sex aids.

I wish I could type something like that with a straight face…
Fumbles

@Cindy Claveau

2. How can you have pedophilia on a service where minimum age is 18?

erm how is the minimum age 18? I just created an account based entirely on false information. Their validation is a joke.

Step one: create an alias email account using no real info. check
Step two: create a SL life account and link the email to the one created in step one and tell SL you were born in 1909. check
Step three: open email account and click confirmation link
Step four: log in.

Seriously how is age enforced when that is possible?
Gx1080

Alright, pornography lawsuits aren’t going to surprise nobody, but I
Cindy Claveau

@Fumbles: The accusation was that SL is a cesspool of pedophilia. If I were a pedo I would not start looking for victims on services where people are *supposed* to be over 18. Not when there are free teen chat rooms all over the place.

Like Wow *ducks*
Gx1080

(got cut).

shouldn’t be surprised about it. My bad.

I’m not saying that LL isn’t banning ageplay and fighting pedophilia, I’m saying that the Second Life users are complaining about it when it’s the rational decision to any company that wants to avoid the FBI. Besides pedos are sickfucks.

And you, like many, many guys say “It’s for people of 18 years and older” but neither you or Linden Labs have any way to check if the user are 18 years old or more. It seems that this little detail it’s always forgotten. I wonder why.
Cindy Claveau

@Gx1080: Try reading the lawsuit so you can have a halfway intelligent, relevant conversation on this topic. Because so far, you haven’t:

http://download.prototerra.s3.amazonaws.com/photos/Complaint_-_FINAL.pdf
Iconic

Boy, Raph Koster must be so excited to see this lawsuit.

You know that a virtual world has ceased to be merely virtual when your merchants actually start to rebel against the king because their inalienable right to private property is being threatened.

All human behavior is economic behavior, and it doesn’t get much more economic than that.
Takuan Daikon

I’m personally very pleased to see Second Life content creators sticking up for this issue. There are a great many SL creators getting their s**t pushed in by Linden Lab, and only a very few like Stroker that have the means to do anything about it.
Gx1080

@Cindy Claveau

I was talking about the general attitude of the Second Life community, not of the lawsuit. But let’s talk abut the lawsuit.

I think that your premise it’s based in several suppositions:

1)Linden Labs has the means to stop unauthorized distribution of digital goods.
This it’s false because, although I suspect that it’s going to be forgotten by your lawyers and I also suspect that it’s forgotten by Second Life users while they have cyber-sex, the goods that you sell are DIGITAL FILES.

What that does mean?

It means that they can be copied an unlimited number of times just pressing a button. Just as the Record Industry Association of America (RIAA) discovered before you, you can eliminate the most flagrant cases, the massive underground copy-pasta will continue to be happening. In 4chan, for example, I can find any book that I want in a .pdf file.

That’s without mentioning that, as a programmer, the only defense in a file that doesn’t have to be maintained constantly aka one that needs direct connection with a server it’s a serial code. Do I have to point that serial codes are usually cracked in the first hours of the launch of a program?

2)Linden Labs wants to hurt your business.

What, what Linden Labs would win if you guys are out of business? They would lose free publicity, they would lose a source of content that they don’t have to develop and they would lose a feature of their product, the capacity of guys like you having a business.

I’m pretty sure that you are going to paint you case as the poor little developers unjustly left to rot by the evil Linden Labs instead of telling it as it is: Two companies with high revenue using a lawsuit as a weapon to demand a third one to make a massive profit sink that it’s going to be highly ineffective.

I foresee an out of court settlement, because you are basically asking Linden Labs to bleed money. And that money will be mostly wasted.
Cindy Claveau

@Gx1080: Your ill-informed assumptions regarding SL are still so far off base it’s a joke, but we can agree that this will probably be settled out of court.

LL’s history has always been that they require a swift kick in the tush to get something done (see also: gambling ban persuant to the Safe Port Act of 2006). And furthermore, not all class action suits are adversarial. In this case, Stroker has been in constant communication with Linden Lab for years. They’re on a first name basis. In their last attempt to removed stolen content, they “mistakenly” deleted key scripts in virtually every single one of his thousands of delivered furniture items, making them useless. This is the company you’re claiming has no means to stop theft. You’re wrong. They do, including placing a premium membership requirement on in-world businesses. They just need to think it through better than they have.

LL is not going out of business over this. They have key programming and policy staff who actually agree that content theft is a major issue. That’s why Stroker was told he had to sue them to get something accomplished. It wasn’t a taunt or a dare, it was a statement of fact. Understand that? LINDEN LAB STATED THE METHOD OF REACHING A RESOLUTION, and it involved filing a lawsuit.

So Stroker did as they said. Now maybe something can be done.
Vetarnias

I have a question for Cindy Claveau. Just one.

Are you in any way involved in this lawsuit, or with someone who is? (Or are you stuck in a similar situation? So I guess that’s one question and a half.)

Because I don’t recall seeing you post on this blog before, and you seem too defensive about the issue to be someone just interested in casually discussing the problem.
http://www.brokentoys.org/ Scott Jennings

Cindy is an SL user who has followed this blog for a while and probably followed a link I posted on an SL-specific forum to this post.

To say that this is an issue of some passionate significance to SL users is an understatment. The thread on the subject at SLU (the most popular third-party SL board) is up to 22 pages.

http://www.sluniverse.com/php/vb/general-sl-discussion/34189-stroker-munchflower-initiate-class-action.html
http://dsob.wordpress.com geldonyetich

geldonyetich,

As a SL content creator I find you implication that most content is regurgitated cut and paste from the internet very insulting, as well as saying most users are sexual deviants. and that we whore ourselves.

I take pride in my creations and don’t need to (and don’t) steal anything from anyone, believe it or not some people actually have creative talent. I make things I like, if others enjoy them and buy them great, But that is hardly whoring myself out.

I find it very satisfying that people like my work enough that they are willing to pay me for it. And last I checked being paid for your work isn’t unethical.
You know, I will happily apologize for any falsehood I brought upon your good name if I spoke incorrectly.

However, I have to say that I’m under the firm belief that if I find your stand in Second Life and it’s full of textures and polygons of various vaginas, penises, tits, and/or sex toys, then you’re in the business of getting people off for money. Like it or not, you’re a pornographer.

Furthermore, if you’re stealing content off the internet to create the skins that go off the things you’re selling, you’re a thief. Maybe you, yourself, are not an individual who does this, but I have discovered a considerable amount of such content when I was in Second Life, including a number of bootleg porno movies.

So, while I too can appreciate taking pride in your creations, if you really feel insulted by the allegations I’ve made because you feel they apply directly to you, perhaps you should spend more time looking in the mirror. I will not apologize for telling things as they are.
http://dsob.wordpress.com geldonyetich

Here’s how that last post was supposed to look:

geldonyetich,

As a SL content creator I find you implication that most content is regurgitated cut and paste from the internet very insulting, as well as saying most users are sexual deviants. and that we whore ourselves.

I take pride in my creations and don’t need to (and don’t) steal anything from anyone, believe it or not some people actually have creative talent. I make things I like, if others enjoy them and buy them great, But that is hardly whoring myself out.

I find it very satisfying that people like my work enough that they are willing to pay me for it. And last I checked being paid for your work isn’t unethical.

You know, I will happily apologize for any falsehood I brought upon your good name if I spoke incorrectly.

However, I have to say that I’m under the firm belief that if I find your stand in Second Life and it’s full of textures and polygons of various vaginas, penises, tits, and/or sex toys, then you’re in the business of getting people off for money. Like it or not, you’re a pornographer.

Furthermore, if you’re stealing content off the internet to create the skins that go off the things you’re selling, you’re a thief. Maybe you, yourself, are not an individual who does this, but I have discovered a considerable amount of such content when I was in Second Life, including a number of bootleg porno movies.

So, while I too can appreciate taking pride in your creations, if you really feel insulted by the allegations I’ve made because you feel they apply directly to you, perhaps you should spend more time looking in the mirror.
Stranger

ROFL at this porno creator Stroker, so when he made million$ ,LL was nice and perfect.When something wrong with grid,sure need sue this company.He sue peoples who let him made alot of money,prolly this much he never can imagine make in RL,thats was his point to build it in SL.Im sure Lindens help to him and answer at any of his reports,but it not enough to this pornocreator,he want got more millions lmao.I just dont know is it legal run sex porno stuff in RL like he run in SL ?With prostitution,sex escorts,bdsm shit ,and make money with this things?Sure he will sit in some prison near and hide his ass from guys with muscules.And point #2 is – LL not ask this Kevin,to sit here and play this game,If you dont like rules,dont like how LL work, feel free cancel your account and enjoy your Real Life without this bandits and Thefts.Big problem in SL, they let to be online retards and noisey idiots like Kevin…
http://blog.weflyspitfires.com We Fly Spitfires

I agree with your assessment about just trying to get attention. I really don’t think Linden Labs will appreciate this and personally I think the grounds are kinda ridiculous.
http://dsob.wordpress.com geldonyetich

Actually, I do see one potential thing I should apologize for, and that’s the suggestion that the “average Second Life content creator” is automatically a pornographer who steals things off the Internet. It was intended to be an exaggeration because nobody knows for sure who the “average Second Life content creator” really is.

It is, I think, a fair assumption on the grounds that if I were to log in on Second Life late Friday Evening and try to find out where the majority of players are right now, the path will lead directly to the red light districts. Consequently, those looking to make a profit in Second Life are highly encouraged to develop content for the red light district. Ergo, the average content creator in Second Life will be a pornographer.

However, that’s about it. We could quibble over the meaning of what “whoring one’s self out is,” but I’m pretty sure that most pornographers would not only agree that they are whoring themselves out, circuitously, through through work, but they’re actually pretty proud of it. So a pornographer who says they’re insulted that I said they are what they definitely is probably on the ignorant end of a journey of self discovery.
Imp

I have been selling in SL for over 3 years, I was a merchant when copybot made its way into SL. as far as i know every tool now in use to steal content is derived from the original copybot source code.

The copybot tool was created by libsecondlife(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CopyBot), a legitimate opensource group that worked closely with the linden labs development team, they created it with the intent of it being a legitimate back up tool (you can see where this is going lol).
LL could have easily averted this mess, all they would have had to do most likely, is simply ask libsecondlife not to release it to the public, But as usual they took the hands off approach, they did absolutely nothing, they took the stance of not wanting to interfere with the creativity of the libsecondlife developers.

To this very day, using copybot within SL is not even a TOS violation, the only stance LL took was to say if you use it inappropriately then it is a TOS violation (ie to steal content) They still consider it a legitimate tool.

I cant speak for the people suing over this and don’t overly have an opinion on weather they should or not, But I do know that it often takes a lawsuit before a corporation will pay attention to things.

Almost every single policy change in SL has been from the result of fear of being sued or prosecuted. So if you think about it, LL pretty much demonstrated whats required to effect change in LL policy lol

As for me, I don’t need LL to hire a mountain of people or jump thou ridicules hoops. but it irritates me to no end that they have done absolutely nothing.

As it is now, you have to file a legal copyright violation notice with LL before they will even investigate copyright infringement. there is no way a merchant can even remotely stay on top of that, the content thieves have no restrictions, and can just pop up somewhere else at the slightest hint of trouble.

The best you can do is stop the people that are inadvertently reselling your content (they were sold it as part of a business in a box package and don’t realize its stolen).

Like I said, I don’t need or expect them to preform miracles, but it would be nice if they would at least make a token effort to do something.

And before you say anything, yes I realize if copybot hadn’t come out eventually something else probably would have. but that is no reason to ignore it.
Stranger

Look,he sued LL because they Let to thefts steal his things,I dont remember anyone in sl who use copybot and in next day his account will still alive.For this copybot thing LL not just ban accounts,they delete from grid ppls who use this.If someone can steal it not Lindens problem,it same like u rent appartments in hotel and some fool steal your clothes in room,u will sue hotel owner too ?My point need get rid from this silly pedophils like stroker,til LL not shut down grid with all use together.If they close SL,What we all win?We can talk garbage about LL,SL,BUT THIS COMPANY MAKE TO US THIS PLACE,where we find each other and where alot Normal humans make some money.Im sure Judges will laffin in this oldmen face about this stuff lmao,I wish to LL win this case and ban this fool with his perver shit forever )
Imp

geldonyetich,
I make clothing, not sex toys, My store is on the mainland and did not “require” being moved to the new adult continent, I use illustrator, photoshop, and 3D Max to create 100% of my clothing textures and clothing attachments, the closest I come to not using my own work is using library fabric materials in max to use as bumbmaps for my clothing. It cant take me 15-20 hours just to create one outfit. My clothing could and probably would be described as provocative, but hardly pornographic, you could see it on a beach or newspaper ad.

And I don’t have to look down my nose at other people and assume the worst about them to feel good about myself, I prefer creative outlets for that.
http://dsob.wordpress.com geldonyetich

@Imp
Well, okay, then – other than the exaggerated, “average Second Life content creator” label (elaborated upon in my last comment) nothing I was talking about in my first comment had anything to do with you. I was just stressing on the irony of what Second Life attempted to accomplish versus what actually manifested in many cases.
Gx1080

@Cindy Claveau

Are you saying that Linden Labs told the guy to sue them? There must be a more educated way to say it but: What the fuck are you smoking?

That said, the eternal struggle between players that want their ponies(million$) no matter what and developers that work in a company with a bottom line it’s as old as time. Here’s an example:

http://brokentoys.org/2009/03/23/rights-profit-drama/
Cindy Claveau

Vetarnias said: “I have a question for Cindy Claveau. Just one.

Are you in any way involved in this lawsuit, or with someone who is? (Or are you stuck in a similar situation? So I guess that’s one question and a half.)

Because I don’t recall seeing you post on this blog before, and you seem too defensive about the issue to be someone just interested in casually discussing the problem.”

1. I am not a party to the lawsuit. I am, however, friends with Stroker. He is a very bright, kind-hearted man of high character. He is also NOT a “pornographer” (he and I were LOL’ing about that earlier – I guess Trojan are also pornographers ).
2. I generally don’t post on blogs like this, but I have been following Broken Toys for a long long time and consider Lum a friend of mine through SL. Usually I agree with him – but not on this issue.
3. I don’t feel I’ve been defensive – I get impatient with people who insist on making demonstrably false statements and ridiculous assumptions about things they don’t know anything about. In this case, Second Life has been my virtual home for the past 4 1/2 years and, as flawed as it is, I’ve stuck with it longer than I stuck with UOL (2 years), SWG, EQ (4 years), CoH or WoW (2 years).

Speaking of which – I have to laugh at the idea that I’m defensive when I’ve read things fifty times worse on about every single game board I’ve ever belonged to on the internet. That includes a stint as a moderator on the old Sony boards. If you want a list of the flaws of SL, I’d be happy to provide them.

But if you did that, you’d be asking instead of assuming. Most of you are doing just that – assuming – because you have no clue about Second Life beyond what you hear third hand.

Next.

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