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As Political A Post As You Are Likely To See
I am a conservative and I will be voting for Barack Obama. Here’s why (sanitized behind a cut-line so as not to get in the way of your zombies and warhammer posts!):
Foreign Policy: I admit it – I’m a foreign policy wonk and history nutter. I have a bit more of an interest in such things than most, which does shade how I view the various candidates, and also means I have a bit more authority (even if self-granted) to comment on this than other issues.
John McCain would, at first blush, appear to have the more serious foreign policy credentials. However, almost every statement he has made on foreign policy issues has been reckless and, well, ignorant. His constant attacks on Barack Obama’s willing to “meet with dictators without preconditions” is silly. Of course one would hope America deals with our enemies using diplomacy. That is, after all, how countries interact. It does not mean going off to Teheran hat in hand hoping for a “peace in our time” speech (and it wasn’t what Obama meant when he gave the quote that McCain has been hammering on since), but it does mean challenging those who oppose American interests with every tool in the US arsenal, not simply that of the gun.
And speaking of the gun, America has been far too inclined to use it this past decade. Whether or not the invasion of Iraq was justified (I don’t believe it was; neither does Obama), the fact remains that the war being fought there now is *not* a “war on terror” or a “war on al’Qaeda” (nor was it when we invaded, something Republicans consistently conflate), but a civil war between ethnic groups within Iraq. This is not a war American lives should be be shed for, and our troops must be withdrawn with all due possible haste. Obama has promised to do this, and McCain has mocked those (including the bipartisan Iraq Study Group) which insisted on this, calling them “defeatists” and accused them of demanding America’s “surrender”. Yet given the overstretch our military is suffering, keeping our military engaged in Iraq, in a war we have zero vital interests in other than national ego, those who insist on our remaining in Iraq do America harm. On this issue alone, a vote for Obama over McCain is a necessity.
On other issues, both candidates tend to agree: a stronger intervention in Afghanistan (whose rehabilitation is in America’s interests), challenging Iran and using American influence to halt its nuclear weapons development, and a careful eye on Pakistan and Russia. It does bear noting that an Obama presidency would find it far easier to achieve these goals, simply because the Bush administration has burned so many bridges among our putative allies in blind pursuit of unilateral goals. McCain, by contrast, seems willing to continue this pattern (most notably more willing to insult Spain, a NATO member state and key ally, rather than admit he had confused President Zapatero of Spain with President Calderon of Mexico during an interview).
Given Obama’s thin resume, It was his job this campaign to convince the voters that he is capable of handling America’s foreign policy requirements; he has done so admirably.
The Economy: We are in the early stages of a recession. Arguing over whether it is due to Republican deregulation or Democratic mortgage law manipulation is a sideshow at this point; the clear duty of the next President will be to propose budgets that have some hope of minimizing the damage. Paradoxically for those of us who have lived through the 1970s and 1980s, the Democrats are now the party of fiscal responsibility, while the Republicans, in their last decade of power, have shown a complete inability to control spending, while enacting fiscally irresponsible tax cuts aimed at the wealthy top 1% or less of society.
McCain has recently hammered Obama as something of a socialist (ironic given the Bush adminstration’s effective nationalization of the mortgage and banking industries) for advocating “redistribution of wealth”. This is specious. Taxation by its nature is redistributive; any alternatives (such as flat tax or sales VAT schemes) would unfairly burden precisely the segment of society that can least afford it. The argument is not over whether taxation itself is welcome; John McCain is far from a libertarian, and his attempting to make that argument is absurd. The argument is simply over how that burden will be distributed – in effect whether the tax burden will be redistributed to the wealthy or the poor. Most fair people, regardless of their political leaning, would argue the former. This is why we have a progressive tax system, after all.
The problem then is not the nature of taxation, but its application or lack thereof. P J O’Rourke, in one of his breezy travelogue/political diatribes, looked at the essentially libertarian government of Hong Kong (pre-Chinese takeover) and noted that for government to truly get itself out of the way actually requires a lot of effort. For government to be invisible, it must be effective – and that requires funding. By contrast, the Federal government this past decade has been anything but. FEMA’s fumbling response to Katrina should be uppermost in everyone’s minds, but that is not the only example – our highway system is collapsing (sometimes literally), and our health care system is in a state of siege. The few things our government SHOULD be involving itself in, it is failing at. Some of this is a failure of leadership and priority, but much of this is also due to a simple lack of funding. Before all else, our government must simply do its job, and part of that is in enacting budgets that are balanced and realistic. A balanced budget will also help shore up our collapsed currency, and restore some confidence to the global economy.
Again, Obama is the more serious candidate here. Neither Obama nor McCain have promised balanced budgets (which is probably for the best given a recessionary economy) but Obama’s proposals are better thought out than McCain’s, who relies on railing against congressional earmarks, which while good theatre are a small fraction of the Federal budget.
This is not to say that there are not many issues that I disagree with Obama on in terms of economic policy. Simply put, I am a fiscal conservative and Obama is a classical liberal. Yet, ironically, he still is the more attractive choice for fiscal conservatives, if for no other reason then because he is the one candidate apparently capable of using a calculator, which says more to the bankruptcy of Republican thought than anything else.
Culture, Palin, and thought: The last point is something that the Republican party has to face if it will survive the next decade: among many other ill-concieved decisions, in embracing Sarah Palin and the social conservatism that she represents, the Republican party has made itself the standard bearer for anti-intellectualism.
Sarah Palin, as best as anyone can tell, has no opinions. On anything. In her few unscripted interviews, she has been unable to answer such simple questions as what newspaper she reads in the morning. Her one policy speech has been to support care for disabled children, which while certainly something that we should do as a society as a general rule, is to put it mildly not chief among the issues facing us as a nation. Yet Palin’s, and McCain’s response to the very simple questions raised by Palin’s lack of intellectual curiosity is to attack those who ask the questions, and moreover, to attack the very question itself. “Joe Sixpack” or “Joe the Plumber” wouldn’t ask if Sarah Palin has a foreign policy beyond a woolly grasp of geography.
Instead they would go to political gatherings strongly, horribly reminiscent of Nazi Germany’s Nuremburg rallies to rail at their enemies for being terrorists and socialists and Arabs and the other. Literally. Raising the Republican bogeymen, much as Jews were for the Nazis – no actual meaning, simply the other to scare the faithful with in lieu of an actual reasonable dialogue. This is not merely troubling. It is deeply frightening for anyone with a sense of history, and the Republican campaign has been extremely irresponsible in its prosceution of the campaign and its consequent corrosion of the national dialogue. I disagree with many people politically – this does not mean they are Insert-scary-meaningless-word-here.
This is not occurring in a vacuum. It is part of a pattern shown by today’s Republican leaders and the current Administration – a lack of respect for dissent, an all too easy appeal to fear and the other – sadly made all too easy, and all too quickly exploited, by the 9/11 attacks. If you ask many people today if Saddam Hussein bore responsibility for 9/11, many would say yes. Our government, in this as in so many other ways, has simply failed us. It has devolved to primitive threats of fear and anti-intellectual rejection of reason, something cheered on by the shock-talk conservative partisan media. And we see its application in the McCain campaign and its apparent existence in a strange time continuum where William Ayers is responsible for the stock market collapse and Barack Obama is an Arab terrorist.
This must be confronted. It must be rejected. We as Americans are simply better than this, and we must show this, cleanly and clearly. The appeals to fear and horror must be rejected.
And I have faith, given all of the above, that in a week they will be.
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about 1 year ago
I have an Obama yard sign, an American flag, an ACLU membership, and I know all the words to God Bless America.
According to some, I cannot possibly exist.
This bothers me.
Not as much as waterboarding done in my name bothers me.
about 1 year ago
A-fucking-men.
about 1 year ago
Really well said.
Unfortunately my faith in the American people is not as strong as yours. It does seem that some are starting to take notice to all the shenanigans going on, but it seems there are still a huge amount of people whose motors run on right wing propaganda. I think the majority have not been rattled enough yet to actually “get up, stand up”.
Of course, my paranoid delusional side is mostly convinced that this whole political hoodamaroo is made for television, that both candidates are in fact already bought and paid for by the same “powers that be”, and that any choice “in this matter” that we have as a people is merely an illusion.
I mean.. come on.. its just too perfect… here you’ve got the young, well spoken, intelligent black man rallying around “change”, and the old crotchety, poorly spoken, white man representing a continuation of the same old crap. And “all the little people” polarized to the side of their choosing, bickering with each other about the minutia of the matter.
If I were an evil overlord, keeping the masses in check through a complex system of carrot chasing and debt slavery, that’s *exactly* how I would do it.
P.S. – The Matrix has you.
=)
about 1 year ago
I suppose it was inevitable that you would bring up Nazi Germany.
Countdown until you get spammed by “NObama” minions citing obscure documents that make about as much sense as tea leaves and are slightly less relevant or able to be boiled and imbibed.
about 1 year ago
“Arguing over whether it is due to Republican deregulation or Democratic mortgage law manipulation is a sideshow at this point; ”
Which democratic mortgage law manipulation? if you mean the CRA from 1977 I’d have to say the latest data pretty much puts the cause squarley on entities that were immune to that law.
Country Wide and the other originators of alt-a, sub prime and prime loans were selling loans that only had to be good for 90 days. they tehn sold those instruments in the same way that fannie and freddie had, only with tons less underwriting (achieving record efficency with automatic underwriting). These MBs were then backed by CDS (unregulated insurance) and the SEC allowed banks to have spin off arms that were allowed to create x12 leverage.
If there’s other mortgage manipulation i’d love to hear of it, but so far it sounds like standard main stree to wall street greed (as the ‘independent’ appraisers, brokers and officers were paid by the piece it was in thier best intersts to process as many piecies as possible instead of having to worry about performance reviews based on the health of an employer).
about 1 year ago
Well said. I’d only quibble with: “arguing over whether it is due to Republican deregulation or Democratic mortgage law manipulation is a sideshow at this point” I don’t think it’s a sideshow, it’s not about blame – understanding the origin is crucial to understanding the way out. While the attitude that you don’t need to understand the origin to get out might work with war, it doesn’t work so well with the economy. I’m not going to post it here, but the evidence is very, very strong that this has vanishingly little to do with “Democratic mortgage law manipulation” and much more to do with deregulation (or simply a lack of regulation, which is not just a Republican problem), Greenspan’s policy (fed rate <2% for 3 years = lots of money demanding a better home), corporate focus on near-term profits, and criminal-level incompetence at the rating agencies.
about 1 year ago
I agree with many of your premises and many of your conclusions. But I still can’t bring myself to vote for Obama. I do hope he wins over McCain, but there are so many things about his ideals that I despise that I can’t give him my vote.
Bob Barr ftw!
about 1 year ago
Nice summation of the main reasons that Obama is clearly the reasoned choice. I would also argue that by the basic virtues of his intelligence, temperament, and yes age, that he is a much safer, saner choice for commander in chief.
about 1 year ago
/start2cents
I voted for Bob Barr. This 2 party rule needs to end.
/end2cents
about 1 year ago
I changed my registration to Democrat and will vote as such until the Republicans smell what they’ve been shoveling for the last 12 years and decide to extricate their collective head from Jesus’ ass.
about 1 year ago
There are a lot of legit reasons a moderate conservative might choose Obama over McCaine(although guns and abortion wouldnt be among them.)
But the thought of a Democtatic President, House, and Senate is fucking scarey. We may quickly be reminded that Democrats are just as bad as Republicans.
about 1 year ago
You should check out two books by Thomas Frank, “What’s the Matter With Kansas?” and “The Wrecking Crew”, for background and explanation of the Republican electoral and governance strategies of the last 20 years. Mostly it’s about business first and the rest as smokescreen.
about 1 year ago
I was behind Obama for a while, until he voted yes on FISA. It really cemented the view that no matter how admirable his campaign promises are, he’s still a politician and just as much as ever, our selection of a president is simply a question of which is the lesser evil.
I understand democracy’s function is dependent on compromise, and that’s probably what triggered his vote on FISA, but I think as a presidential candidate who has built his campaign on the concept of “change”, to do something we expect from a normal slimy politician completely undermines the message. If he wants our government to operate at a higher standard, he really should have at least held himself to it.
about 1 year ago
WORD.
about 1 year ago
Sadly, I agree with this from Recursion Of course, my paranoid delusional side is mostly convinced that this whole political hoodamaroo is made for television, that both candidates are in fact already bought and paid for by the same “powers that be”, and that any choice “in this matter” that we have as a people is merely an illusion.
I stopped listening to all the hype and have tried to focus on which candidate I feel is the lesser of two evils. It’s just too easy for candidates to talk a good game then produce squat once elected. I’ve decided that voting for president here in the US has become more of a crap shoot then anything else.
My last throw of the dice had Obama winning out.
about 1 year ago
Conservatism cannot fail, it can only be failed.
Conservative principles are a political religion. Thanks for not drinking the kool-aid this year.
about 1 year ago
The only difficult decision I have this voting cycle is between voting for Barr or not bothering to vote at all.
Though I do agree that McCain and the GOP need to lose. If Obama is a socalist, then Bush’s nationalization of our financial institutions must make him a Marxist.
about 1 year ago
Come on man, the choice is clear, Bob Barr!!
Obama = socialist big government given checks to leechers.
McCain= better than Obama on tax issues, but lousy on internation issues (see his reaction on Russia over Gerogia).
Barr = smaller government, lower tax, fiscal responsibility.
about 1 year ago
@Anti-Bunny You just realized Bush is a Marxist??!! You are 4 year too late. If you still have some fighting spirit in you, go vote Barr.
about 1 year ago
I will never understand the people who complain about the two mainstream candidates then throw in a ‘Bob Barr!’ Its like complaining the chicken coup isn’t safe enough then voting for a fox to guard it.
If you want to vote 3rd party, vote for a decent third party candidate. Don’t vote for a man who was a very vocal participant in the war on drugs, authored a bill to ban same-sex marriages, voted for the Patriot Act, voted to restrict what religion the military allows, and now wants you to believe he’ll lead the ‘keep government small’ charge.
about 1 year ago
You’re not a conservative. Don’t pat yourself on the back too hard Mr. “I put up banners celebrating the October Revolution without consideration that one of my co-workers may have actually suffered through that tragedy of human history”.
about 1 year ago
Obama is not even close to being a socialist and the fact that you think he is speaks volumes for the level of the political debate amongst low information voters.
Plus, there’s a pretty clear correlation for the past forty years or so for actual fiscal responsibility mostly happening under a Democratic administration while the polar opposite tends to happen under Republican presidents.
Finally the government is bigger under Bush (who certainly is not a socialist of any stripe) than it ever has been since WWII. Small government does not automatically equal efficiency. You need to achieve efficiency first then government can scale back, otherwise you end up with a third-world society.
about 1 year ago
Not one word from anyone on the environment and green issues
about 1 year ago
I had a co-worker that was over 90 years old? The gaming industry is more inclusive than I thought.
about 1 year ago
I think the republican party might be approaching a split of some point as the portion of republicans who believe in small government/lower taxes pull away from the republicans who believe in social conservatism/bigger government/under educated.
I agree with the republican ideal of smaller government to a certain extent, but despise their position on social issues.
Personally I want to see a democrat have the balls to go in, keep taxes high enough TEMPORARILY to pay down our horrendous debt, then do some careful program slashing.
FYI It is absolutely imperative that the US start improving it’s educational provisions if we are to remain economically and socially competitive in the changing world before us, by the way, global dominance is now due much more to economic and social competitiveness then military might.
about 1 year ago
Obama is not even close to being a socialist and the fact that you think he is speaks volumes for the level of the political debate amongst low information voters.
I would have to say you are wrong. I would additionally characterize McCain as too socialist. As well as almost every President since Coolidge.
about 1 year ago
The Internet is left leaning? Who knew?
about 1 year ago
Wouldn’t it be nice if you could vote for a candidate who encompassed ALL of your views and not just 49% of them? Too bad we were raised by government schools that told us we had only two choices.
about 1 year ago
It might have helped if America was at all united as a country on more than a few issues, or probably more importantly, most of us recognized politics as necessarily about informed, respectful and intellectual debate and compromise.
Obama was the only candidate this election who consistently talked about America having the chance to come to the table without a shield in one hand and a machine gun in the other.
That counts for something.
about 1 year ago
Scott, you’re an intelligent guy, but I think you are wrong. Here’s why, and I hope you’ll take the time to go through this and rethink your stance.
The Iraq war:
First off, why do you feel that rehabilitating Afghanistan is important but not Iraq?
Secondly, the Iraq Study Group report did not call for an immediate withdrawal.
To quote that study:
“The Iraqi government should accelerate assuming responsibility for Iraqi security by
increasing the number and quality of Iraqi Army brigades. While this process is under way, and
to facilitate it, the United States should significantly increase the number of U.S. military
personnel, including combat troops, imbedded in and supporting Iraqi Army units. As these
actions proceed, U.S. combat forces could begin to move out of Iraq.”
Third, the Iraq invasion was necessary, here’s why.
First of all, you know it would be very bad to allow Iran to get Nukes. Once they have them, it’s too late. Why do people fail to recognize this with regard to Iraq?
To get nukes, you need several things, all of which Iraq either had or was very close to getting.
1) Missile delivery system- Check, Iraq had missiles that would go even beyond the range that was dictated in the peace accord from the first Iraq war and was a serious claim against them by itself. North Korea was selling even farther range missiles, and after reading the rest of this you’ll see that Iraq buying these would be a clear sign they had succeeded in making Nukes.
2) The tech- check, hidden under the rose bush primarily, and elsewhere in related tech. Scientists from the original nuke program, which was closed, were hiding various documentations related specifically to the nuke program. Included were parts for reference when the nuke program was started back up (more later on this). Pic below of some of what was found under that rose bush, and link to that article from CNN.
3) The yellowcake, processed uranium that needs further processing, to make weapons grade uranium- Check. The US shipped 550 metric tons (enough to make about 100 nuclear bombs) of yellowcake to Canada in a secret project earlier this year. The yellowcake itself was known and controlled by the inspection teams, from Iraq’s earlier nuke program. But the shipment of it was a closely guarded secret for fears of sabotage or ambush. This was a large operation.
4) The equipment to refine the yellowcake. This was the one thing Iraq was missing. It included things like the aluminum tubes, you know, duo use things that the world was blaming bush for including in his arguments. And while Iraq was going about trying to gain the ability to produce these things, or buy them directly, most of the world was screaming fowl at Bush instead of Saddam.
5) The technicians and scientists to operate a renewed secret nuke program- Check. Most of Iraq’s nuclear techs and scientists from the dissolved first nuke program were hired on in jobs that would maintain their knowledge and skills in further development in a new nuke program. They were ready to go, all they needed was the equipment to refine yellowcake into weapons grade material. Remember that super cannon Iraq was making? How ludicrous was that, a single, unmovable canon that could be taken out with one quick strike. Why did they put so much effort into building it? The skills to bore that were something like “duo use” in making aluminum tubes for refining yellowcake, as an example.
6) Money- Check. The Oil for Food scandal was supplying Saddam with lots of money. Moreover it was untraceable money so that Iraq could better hide a reconstituted nuclear program.
7) A blind eye from the world- check, or almost so. And you can thanks Bush for this. The Oil for Food scandal also provided Saddam with influence around the world and within the UN. Kofi Annan’s own son was involved. Others involved in the scandal were military leaders and wealthy businessmen in France, Germany, and Russia, as well as around the world.
And if you’ll remember, Saddam was trying to get rid of the WMD inspectors. He tried to say that they were no longer needed, tried to get that through the UN. When it failed due to the Bush administration’s efforts, Saddam outright kicked them out. The UN was almost ready to go along with it, except for the US and a very few key allies.
So, in a nutshell, Iraq was almost there, almost ready to restart a nuclear program, secretly, without trace, and quickly. And thanks to Jimmy Carter’s dismantling of intelligence in the Middle East, we would not know about it unless we got very lucky. And even if we did, we’d still have to deal with the influence Saddam was buying through the Oil for Food scandal. And once Iraq had nuclear capability, well, they’d already used WMDs (chemical and biological) something like 8 times.
But the world’s response to all this is “well, I hate Bush” and “your a dumb ass”. You know, sensible things like that.
Now on to economics. Yes, the Republicans have failed us. So have the Democrats. They are lumped together in this through infighting and bad ideas from both sides.
But the Democrats “give a man a fish” system is not what we need. We need more jobs and better pay scales at the lower ends.
Obama’s plans to increase taxes on business will cost jobs. Not only will it take funds away from businesses, increasing their expenses with no profits to show for it, causing business growth to slow and reinvestment to slow, costing us fewer new jobs and more layoffs. And more business will go outside our country. Supplies will cost less from foreign sources while American companies’ expenses go up because of higher taxes, meaning they must charge more for their product. Selling to other countries will become more difficult also.
As far as all the talk, yes it does go too far. It’s politics. It’s sound bites and catch phrases. Obama is not innocent of this either. He’s made plenty of accusations himself, from neo-cons to Bush buddies to racism. And perhaps you shouldn’t neglect MSNBC, ABC, and all the liberal publications when you bring up Fox News.
Between the two, it has been McCain who has been the one to cross political lines to get things done. Obama has voted in lock step with the Democrats all the way along. McCain is the one who really represents “change”, to the point that he had trouble with conservative support. Obama has not had that problem.
about 1 year ago
G. W. Bush, John McCain, Robespierre . . . we are living under a reign of terror in this country. I too hope that this reign of terror will end soon. It’s time we stop letting the fear-mongers lead us.
about 1 year ago
When they throw Michael Moore and Keith Olbermann in a gulag, I will believe in this ‘reign of terror’.
Until then, I will point and laugh.
about 1 year ago
Great post, you pretty much hit the nail on the head. I would like two point out two things:
1. Up until roughly a week and a half ago, McCain was still promising to balance the budget by the end of his first term, all while maintaining the Bush tax cuts and our presence in Iraq indefinitely.
2. At the policy speech by Palin, she highlighted the need for autism research while simultaneously decrying a study being funded by the government dealing with fruit flies. As it turns out, the fruit fly study she was talking led to a breakthrough in autism research. She is beyond incompetent.
about 1 year ago
“Simply put, I am a fiscal conservative and Obama is a classical liberal.”
Classical liberals are fiscal conservatives, in that classical liberalism promotes minimal state intervention in the economy. Obama is an American-style liberal, i.e. a social democrat.
While the point is moot since Obama is up better than twenty points in my state, I can’t vote for him. He’s definitely the lesser of two evils, but there’s not enough good there for me to actively support his candidacy. On three issues of the past year that have been particularly important to me–the FISA/telecom immunity bill, the bailout bill and the South Ossetia crisis–Obama either dithered impotently or absented himself from taking any sort of stand. Beyond that, nothing in either his government career or his work in the private sector suggests any profound capacity for leadership: he was an invisible member of the Illinois Senate, a rank-and-file member of Congress, a failed community organizer and an law school instructor who produced no legal scholarship. His shifting the goalposts on Iraq withdrawal and his silly threat to invade Pakistan don’t exactly fill me with confidence either.
Not that McCain has much of anything in his favor aside from his POW story, his rich wife and his long-forgotten love affair with the press back when he was badmouthing the religious right. But I’d be tempted to support his lost cause if only to uphold the virtue of divided government, if not for the fact that Congressional Democrats have demonstrated throughout Bush’s lame-duck term that they’re willing to toady to the White House as long as it allows them to disavow any responsibility for their actions.
about 1 year ago
“Barr = smaller government, lower tax, fiscal responsibility…”
…eats Borat’s cheese.
about 1 year ago
There’s something surreal watching the elections in the US. Here in Canada, what is considered “right” would be considered “left” in the US link. When I hear comments about Obama being a socialist, I can only wonder what conservatives here are…
I was curious and did a quick check and according to http://www.bls.gov, unemployement rate is about the same in the US as in Canada, 6.1%. It’s needed to consider that about half our paychecks disappear before reaching our pockets (companies are also heavily taxed).
And our roads are also in a very bad state link 1 link 2
So going left or right doesn’t matter much, the results are the same.
about 1 year ago
Eventually we’ll end all this voting stuff and go straight to death matches for President. Want to be President? Hope you’re willing to kill for it or die trying. A national broadcast sponsored by the commercial interests with proceeds going to education of course.
about 1 year ago
You are clearly not a conservative. If calling yourself one makes you feel better, then go right ahead, but you spout liberal talking point after liberal talking point.
Obama will raise your taxes (and not just income taxes) and support more gun control. And our enemies will celebrate all over the world.
impeachobama.wordpress.com
about 1 year ago
I still have a Dennis Kucinich sticker on my car. Obama? Way too conservative for me, thanks.
hahaha. impeachobama.wordpress.com “Our enemies will celebrate all over the world!” I think that’s going to be my new catch phrase.
“Flagship studios is going down! Our enemies will celebrate all over the world!”
“Fable 2 has shitty multiplayer! Our enemies will celebrate all over the world!”
“They totally didn’t give me the sale price on a gallon of milk the other day at the supermarket, even though it was clearly marked! Our enemies will celebrate all over the world!”
about 1 year ago
As someone not living in the US I find it quite interesting that Mr. Obama is considered as a “socialist”. Looking at my neighbors the Germans, French and Italians I cannot see Mr. Obama as being a left-winger or even a socialist. But I think due to only having two major parties in the country one can only see the black and white picture.
about 1 year ago
I hope you guys make the right choice for your country.
Being from Europe I can’t really say that your image is as shiny as it was back in the day.
But I know it is mostly down to your government choices, everyone did not agree with them.
I think it is sad that a lot of people who are not American look at the US now and think “Oh these guys are awful they just want money and war, while chanting God Bless America”.
Anyway I hope that Obama will be elected because I can’t see your image getting better with McCain!
about 1 year ago
Nit to pick:
Spain is a constitutional monarchy, with a king as head of state. Consequently, Spain does not have a president. José Luis Rodríguez Zapatero is “el presidente del gobierno” – in function equivalent to what in the English-speaking world is more commonly called a prime minister.
The interviewer got it wrong too but McCain didn’t know enough to correct that. Not only did McCain not know Zapatero by name, he apparently didn’t even know the first thing about the government and constitution of one of America’s strongest European allies.
Ain’t I glad that at least McCain’s (other-)wordly running mate has such extensive foreign policy credentials, knowing as she does that her next-door neighbors are foreign countries, there in the state that she is the executive of…
about 1 year ago
@ 20 & wowpanda
wowpanda Says:
“Come on man, the choice is clear, Bob Barr!!
Obama = socialist big government given checks to leechers.
McCain= better than Obama on tax issues, but lousy on internation issues (see his reaction on Russia over Gerogia).
Barr = smaller government, lower tax, fiscal responsibility.”
Funny, did you know that Alan Greenspan was one of the original members of the Randian school that was setup? That he is a very devoted objectivist?
Guess what happened when he got in charge of the fed? All the good little producers turned out to be ‘leechers’.
Objectivism fails.
about 1 year ago
Very well said Scott.
about 1 year ago
Gawain Says:
October 29, 2008 at 12:27 am
I still have a Dennis Kucinich sticker on my car. Obama? Way too conservative for me, thanks.
hahaha. impeachobama.wordpress.com “Our enemies will celebrate all over the world!” I think that’s going to be my new catch phrase.
“Flagship studios is going down! Our enemies will celebrate all over the world!”
“Fable 2 has shitty multiplayer! Our enemies will celebrate all over the world!”
“They totally didn’t give me the sale price on a gallon of milk the other day at the supermarket, even though it was clearly marked! Our enemies will celebrate all over the world!”
Ouch I snorted at that. Luckily I had finished my coffee.
And hey, even if Mr TinFoilHat is right, what’s the problem? Americas enemies all over the world wouldn’t be in any fit state to get up in the morning let alone plan the downfall of nations with the hangover that much supposed celebrating would cause.
about 1 year ago
Wow you managed to get every single word of that sentence wrong, grats.
about 1 year ago
Not every single one, Elbows. If a justice that supports the individual-right approach to the Second Amendment retires during Obama’s presidency–both Scalia and Kennedy are 72, and may not have the staying power of Justice Stevens–the 5-4 majority in Heller will likely be reversed. The collective-right approach of the minority would allow for sweeping restrictions on legal gun ownership.
Both ideological wings of the Court like to restrict certain constitutional freedoms while building up certain others. Just as with our elected representatives, it’s often a case of having (at best) a lesser-of-two-evils decision. (Although for those who are single-issue voters on gun control, abortion or what have you, the decision is probably easier.)
about 1 year ago
When ever you attack, you need to specify your sources.
@sinnch, check http://www.nolanchart.com/article3849.html
@pharniel Greenspan is a republican, not a libertarian. There are 2 school of leechers, the demos courts the poor welfare mothers with 8 kids, and republicans courts failed wall street execs.
Obama/Demos: raise taxes for working people, hand to people who are too lazy to work, and get their vote. That is Obama’s idea of share wealth.
Republicans (nowadays): pour billions to failed (and stupid) executives who should be bankrupted and broken right now. And they tell us it is for our own good.
You want to share wealth? then lower taxes, let the good people create wealth, let the bad ones bankrupt and their wealth will be managed by more capable people.
Want to lower debt? instead of raise taxes, stop pork first! Those in Washington will prefer to spend what ever amount is raised first.
about 1 year ago
Wowpanda where do you get your information on Obama’s tax plan? You’re so wrong it’s laughable.
http://www.parade.com/news/intelligence-report/archive/how-much-would-you-pay-taxes.html
about 1 year ago
I don’t grasp why people think Obama’s going to jack everyone’s taxes up.
Lowering taxes MORE with a debt and two wars is… insanity. It’s not possible. It’s just not at all doable. I mean, we could cut all of social security, medicare/medicaid and slash the education budget and MAYBE pull it off, but it would suck. Also be monumentally stupid.
As for taxing the workers and giving to the lazy: if you think people making under $250,000 a year are lazy.. Fuck You.
Lowering taxes to promote trickle down economics is what we’ve been doing for ages. It’s not helping reduce the wealth gap. Turns out trickle down economics assumes everyone on the planet is a saint, and nobody’s a dick. Anyone on the internet should understand that what you’re essentially asking is that everyone in every MMO ever roll greed on things they won’t equip immediately, and pass if they think they’ve gotten enough loot this run.
about 1 year ago
@d-one
Read this http://www.heritage.org/research/Taxes/wm1973.cfm
1. You might think 250,000 a year is a lot of money. back in 1995, 30k/year was good salary. now engineers from india makes double as much as new hires. When income tax was first introduced, only top natch people are high enough to pay, now almost all of us need to pay.
2. those people who make that money are most likely small business people. they have high pressures. The stores around my area pay about 2000/month for a small store area in rent alone. Under Obama, their tax rate could be 50%. Do you want to work hard all year long, take the risks, and at end of year have 50% of your revenue submited as tax? That is money they can use to expand, add employees. Now it is gone, be wasted on government pork.
3. Investors with money. Startups cost money, and only 1 out of 10 start ups survive. with the 50% tax rate, I would believe some of the interest investments all of a sudden became too risky. So government waste money on pork well the next google/microsoft is wasted.
Is there any sign of government pork spending slowing down? No. As soon as the election passes, the bridge to nowhere will start again.
about 1 year ago
@kildy, before you spit out f words, learn to read and stop putting words into my mouth. The big problem with debt is spending (pork and the war bush started), to reduce debt, cut spending first.
about 1 year ago
I live in Ohio and already voted there for the election is over. Everyone please shut up. I’ve had enough. Someone make the voices stop! Argghh! I can’t take this anymore! Where’s my gun…..
about 1 year ago
As I understand it, Obama’s business tax change starting at 250k is 250k of profits, not revenue. Capital expenses associated with starting a business can be spread out over many years against revenue, also rent, salaries, the costs of doing business, etc are all set against revenue — by the time you’re looking at paying more in taxes you are already a large and successful business.
And yes, 250k is a lot of money – it’s more than double what I’m currently living on, and I live a pretty decent life. I don’t know how much you’re making, but I only know 1 family who is making more than 250k, and they don’t have a problem with Obama’s tax plan.
about 1 year ago
I want to know what the ‘rich’ line is now. It started at 250k, then in the debates Obama said 200k, then Biden just said 150k during a speech. I think this is combined income for you married folks. If not, please correct me.
about 1 year ago
Obama is the better speaker and has played a cleaner campaign, but I’m not a big fan of giving the democrats control of both congress and the white house. I also have a feeling that Obama is less willing to cut back on government spending then John McCain. I make much less then 250,000 a year so I’m not that threatened by Obama’s tax plan, but I do dread his Health Care program which could turn into yet another line item reduction on my paycheck like Social Security.
about 1 year ago
I miss the Darkfall invasion. Simpler times, simpler minds.
lol @ “impeachobama”. He has to be elected before he can be impeached. Hurr.
about 1 year ago
Thanks for this, Scott. Well said.
about 1 year ago
The line is $250,000. You can find this in any of his policies.
Biden was Technically correct (his statement wasn’t that above 150 you’d be taxed more, it was that people making less than 150,000 would see a tax break, $150,000 is below $250,000 and technically correct in that under $250,000 would see a break).
As for government spending: Obama plans to spend more than McCain on the government. However, due to the tax reduction in McCain’s plan, McCain would grow the deficit more than Obama. While one is a tax and spend liberal, the other is a spend and spend republican. We’re out of fiscal conservatives in power, which is why I’ve abandoned the party.
As for health care line items, I presume you mean McCain’s health care plan. Which would, depending on the day of the week, either slash Medicare/medicaid funding to pay for the tax credit, or tax your health care plan as income. He changes where the money comes from pretty frequently. I believe we’re back to health care plans being taxable income.
about 1 year ago
I am far from that line too, and I have no idea how much others make. However read my comments. The plan will have a effect of slowing good growth, and with increase of living standards, (30k to 60k in 15 years), a lot of us will reach that line sooner than you think.
The big off on his tax plan is, he is getting money from the archivers so they can’t use that to create better wealth, and that money will be run through a much inefficient government, be used on pork, ware etc.
Wealth is created. The more others create it, the more they can be enjoyed (to most of us it will be in the form of increased salary).
Also do you think Obama’s universal health care thing will cost as he claimed. The social security system was supposed to work, you know what is happening.
about 1 year ago
Wowpanda: I’ll drop the F word. 250,000 and up is still the top 5% of the US population. If you feel it’s not much money: A) you suck at budgets, and B) you don’t grasp how large the wealth gap in America is.
As for reducing spending: Obama’s plan grows the national debt slower than McCain’s plan. Ending the war is already on the list. Pork spending is a debatable term. Earmarks are less than 1% of federal spending, and eliminating them doesn’t actually get the 1% back (they rarely allocate new funds, they direct existing funds. A $100 million military spending bill with a $1 million earmark is not a $99 million spending bill without the earmark, it’s a $100m spending bill still.) McCain has not said what he’d magically cut to get this money back, so his savings from fighting pork spending is using his estimated numbers, while Obama’s plan is quite spelled out.
But still, I stand by my statement: if you think anyone making less than 250,000 is lazy (which is pretty much what you said by Obama wanting to give money to the lazy people and tax the workers, since he wants to tax anyone making over $250,000, that means by your own statement under that = lazy not workers.) Fuck You.
about 1 year ago
Thus far, the wealth gap is growing in the US. Do you know what that means?
It means your “archivers” aren’t spending their money, they’re gaining more of it. Since it’s nearly a zero sum game (barring inflation), this money is coming from somewhere. More specifically it means that they’re not spending it and thus putting the money back into other people’s hands.
Trickle Down Economics doesn’t work. Never has.
But heck, let’s go with this: Obama wants to raise taxes on anyone making over $250,000 to Clinton era tax rates. Our economy did great, and everyone had a lot more effective money.
As for a lot of us reaching that line: he’s raising the tax on the bracket. If everyone suddenly shows up in that bracket: the brackets change. This is pretty basic information.
about 1 year ago
It’s funny, listening to what people say Obama or McCain is “going to do”. How do you know this? When have politicians lived up to their campaign promises?
Bush 2 didn’t.
Clinton didn’t.
Bush 1 didn’t.
Reagan might have, but I don’t know – I was learning to walk and talk through his presidency.
People will promise all sorts of things to get elected. How can you trust them? Obama’s throwing up more promises than you can count, and McCain’s reinvented himself at least once in the last few years. Neither of these really scream “You can trust me!” to me. *shrug*
/Yes, I AM a cynic, how did you know?
about 1 year ago
Watching your election from this Canadians viewpoint…
I am not familiar with all of the issues, especially the economic ones, so I really don’t understand the details.
But what I see is a young guy that says “change” alot but doesn’t tell anyone what that change is, versus an old guy that had the stuffing kicked out of him in a POW camp.
So i guess it depends on what you are after.
It looks like Obama will win, which will make folks feel better about getting their “change” but it will be interesting seeing this guy running the ship and how he will be dealing with all of the problems going on right now….
about 1 year ago
Kildy,
thanks, much easier to read without “F” words.
Here is wiki site for http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trickle-down_economics, it has pros and cons.
Just monthes after Clinton, stock market clapses. Bush is not that smart but he can’t inflict the damage that quick can he?
And to your last question, why are we (the not so rich) paying incoming taxes? When it is introduced, it was supposed to be a rich man’s tax. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Income_tax_in_the_United_States
that was around 1893, less than 10% of people have $4000 income/year.
Now all that money is on pork and war (even the war funding is pork to some big contracts).
I will only vote for a guy who can get the pork spending under control, and Barr is the most likely (but both party avoid him like plague, they won’t invite him to debats either).
about 1 year ago
Bob Barr, mister Flat Tax? Okay…
As for the stock market collapsing post Clinton, we all know what happened, and we all know it had absolutely nothing to do with presidential politics. The part I WILL fault Clinton on was running with the deregulation of banks (which leads to our current issue)
Trickle Down Economics fails under the basic idea that any increased income to a company will be immediately distributed towards the workers, instead of used to either expand the company or (most frequent right now) turned directly into bonuses for the executives. Very few companies do profit sharing.
What you do see a lot of are misleading statistics. Trickle down’s defense, from your own link is only supported by numbers if you replace it with “how friendly a state is towards free enterprise” which has nothing to do with personal income tax (both R and D candidates have suggested lowering the corporate tax rate, Obama proposes closing all the tax dodges at the same time, however.
Anyways, As for Barr: Go nuts. I think it would rock if there were more parties in the US, but our election system makes any more than 2 active parties cripple the ones closest to each other (if you have 1 conservative party and 2 liberal parties, the liberals just wind up splitting their votes and will always loose, and vice versa. It’s a stupid system.) Though in their defense, the two parties have no say in inviting Barr to debates. They have say in trying to sue to get third party candidates off ballots in states, which is referring to the initial problem with more than 2 parties in the US, but the debate commission decides who to invite.
about 1 year ago
Ross Perot
about 1 year ago
250k is not a lot of money, especially in terms of this wealth gap. The real gap is between those that must work for a living, and those that can live off of their fortunes interest. This will not hurt them at all. Sure Capital gains would go up, but if they have paid off everything, then they actually can have a low income. You can’t really tax equity.
It has been shown that higher capital gains tax actually means less tax revenue for the government. It will also lower investments into businesses, which will eventually result in fewer jobs for the folks this is meant to help.
What I see this as is more of a ‘punishment’ tax, just like his oil windfall tax plan (which will never happen but sounds good to voters). People like to hear that they will go get those rich folks.
Politicians and their tax plans (both parties) always feel like buying votes, hell, Obama has a calculator on his site that basically means : vote for me and I will give you this much money. I don’t know if McCain has a calculator on his site.
about 1 year ago
From Obama:
“In the radio interview, Obama delved into whether the civil rights movement should have gone further than it did, so that when “dispossessed peoples” appealed to the high court on the right to sit at the lunch counter, they should have also appealed for the right to have someone else pay for the meal. Obama said the civil rights movement was victorious in some regards, but failed to create a “redistributive change” in its appeals to the Supreme Court, led at the time by Chief Justice Earl Warren. He suggested that such change should occur at the state legislature level, since the courts did not interpret the U.S. Constitution to permit such change.
“The Supreme Court never ventured into the issues of redistribution of wealth and sort of basic issues of political and economic justice in this society, and to that extent as radical as people try to characterize the Warren Court, it wasn’t that radical,” Obama said in the interview, a recording of which surfaced on the Internet over the weekend.
“It didn’t break free from the essential constraints that were placed by the founding fathers in the Constitution, at least as it has been interpreted.”
ps. McCain hates you just as much.
about 1 year ago
@72, Fail, try again?
about 1 year ago
Bughunter, at least quote the actual statement, not a misleading summary.
“Obama said “one of the, I think, the tragedies of the civil rights movement, was because the civil rights movement became so court focused, I think that there was a tendency to lose track of the political and community organizing activities on the ground that are able to put together the actual coalitions of power through which you bring about redistributive change, and in some ways we still suffer from that.”"
What he was actually saying seems to be that focusing the civil rights movement on the courts wasn’t the most effective way to go, not that it didn’t go far enough. (Further quotes and analysis, including links to both sides, here.)
about 1 year ago
Dailykos links….
I think that the radio quotes is blown out of proportion. However, he did say:
“I’d be okay, but the Supreme Court never entered into the issues of redistribution of wealth, and sort of more basic issues of political and economic justice in this society.”
I don’t want to post the rest of the quote for space sake, people should read it for themselves anyways. But it seems clear “redistribution of wealth” and “economic justice” is something he was interested in.
about 1 year ago
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iivL4c_3pck
Listen for yourself and make your own decisions.
about 1 year ago
Also watching from canada, so I will let Americans choose who is the better man for the job.
But I will also add that those who believe the current economic crisis was brought by lack of “regulation”. Hell, get yourself some basic economic education.
about 1 year ago
You can say all you want that redistribution in the context of the 70s only meant right to education. That doesn’t change the truth of a man wanting to take more money from one group of people, and give it to the 40% of the country who already don’t pay any taxes already. I mean really, do you honestly think those above $250k aren’t just going to increase prices and lower wages to maintain their current status quo?
That should make you just as frightened as an ancient out of touch dungeons and dragons hater that will happily drag us into wars with everyone he possibly can.
I’d vote for any single person involved in this thread, over those two ignorant psychopaths.
about 1 year ago
BugHunter: I’d vote for any single person involved in this thread, over those two ignorant psychopaths.
And our enemies will celebrate all over the world!
about 1 year ago
“I am a conservative and I will be voting for Barack Obama.”
I am not thrilled with McCain, but he is much closer to being a conservative then Obama. How can you say you are a conservative and support a candidate that wants to play Robin Hood and redistribute your wealth? Obama is now waffling on the $250K tax point. It may be as low as $150K.
How much of your opinion has been skewed by the liberal media that seems to polish Obama off at any time and make ridicule of McCain at any point?
Don’t make light of Obama’s alliances. He launched his polical campaign in William Ayer’s house. Now there is a video that the LA Times is holding up with Obama at a going away party for a known PLO supporter. At this party Anti-Semetic poetry was read.
Obama is a politcal neophyte and his alliances are dangerous. With him in office and the congress the way it is our country won’t be the representitive democracy it once was. We will be changed to mob-rule populist socialism.
about 1 year ago
Some brief comments on the comments:
Bob Barr: The fact that the Libertarian Party nominated Bob Barr is an excellent demonstration of how the LP is no longer (if it ever was) actually libertarian. His voting history and views are those of social conservatism, not libertarianism.
Taxes/redistribution of wealth: Unless you are a hard core libertarian and believe that government should tax no one at all (which is an entirely separate discussion, and not an argument either Obama or McCain is making) then the discussion becomes who should bear that burden. It is not a redistribution of wealth (unless the government pushes through yet another useless $400 stimulus check scheme, which is depressingly bipartisan) but a marker of which income bracket should bear more of the burden for governance. And insisting that the lowest paid workers should pay the highest tax burden is not only amoral, it’s nonsensical. As for the wealthiest 1% requiring free capital in order to reinvest – have you been paying attention the past decade? The wealthiest 1% have not been reinvesting in anything save their own wealth. The income disparity between the wealthiest 1% and the lowest 25% is at its largest since… well, ever. Given that, I show no sympathy towards their taxes being raised; and again we are not talking about some Republican-fed nightmare of Marxist nationalization of wealth, but a simple tax hike for those who can well afford it.
$250k is quite a lot of money, actually. Our family makes around $120k and I think we are well off.
Obama “pals around with terrorists”/Ayers/PLO spokespersons: this is simple guilt by association. Bill Ayers is a person with a dark history and reprehensible views, whom Obama has condemend often. Bill Ayers is also not a criminal, but a figure in Chicago-area academia. This says a lot about academia of course, but does it mean that anyone involved with academia in Illinois is now unsuited for higher office? This is a classic example of smearing by association: the Republicans repeat “Obama” and “terrorist” in the same sentence so frequently that you associate the two terms (as can be seen from numerous Republican rallies where the audience outright labels Obama a terrorist). This is propaganda unworthy of a national party.
I do not base my opinions solely on the “liberal media”. I read a *great* deal, much of it blogs of every partisan hue and news sources based outside the US. I will not take credit for that much, but I will demand acknowledgment that I am well-informed.
Rehabilitating Afghanistan is important, Iraq isn’t: Several reasons. First off, Afghanistan pre-2001 was a wholly owned fief of al-Qaeda. Which, unlike Iraq, did actually attack this country. Eliminating the power of al-Qaeda is a national imperative. Second, Iraq’s problems have moved on from the Hussein regime to a fratricidal civil war. Whether or not Iraq had a nuclear weapons program, whether or not sanctions would have eliminated them, the fact remains: Iraq TODAY is fighting a civil war. This is not something America should be involved in. We should not be picking sides between Sunni and Shi’a militiamen. If Iraq is hellbent on national suicide as a consequence of the Baathist overthrow, that is not our problem. It’s our *fault* – but from a very cold calculus of national interests, very much not our problem.
Democratic supremacy of executive/legislative/judicial government is dangerous: yes, I agree, but I think it is a price we need to pay to gain a strong, intellectually honest conservative movement once again. The Republican party is corrupt, and riven with factions (social conservatism, neoconservatism) I want no part of. And if the Democrats overreach, well, that would be a great opportunity for a Republican renewal.
Scott is no longer a conservative: if being called a conservative means being part of the choir while Sarah Palin preaches anti-intellectual cant and divisive hatred, then rip up my fucking party card today.
about 1 year ago
Oh wow look, there’s a smiley face at the bottom of the page, neat.
about 1 year ago
“This must be confronted. It must be rejected. We as Americans are simply better than this, and we must show this, cleanly and clearly. The appeals to fear and horror must be rejected.”
This is by far the best, most honest assessment of the upcoming election as I have seen yet. From a GAMING BLOG. Surely the Apocalypse is upon us.
Well said, Scott. Well said.
about 1 year ago
Scott: Obama is not going after the top 1%. Instead he is going after the ~5%’ers. 250k is chump change in comparison to the actual wealthy.
Obama seems to associate with a lot shady characters. Ayers is definitely someone I would not want to associate with on any level, as he does not regret his past actions.
As for Iraq…it is a civil war, but whether we like it or not, the outcome will affect us in the future. A Democratic Iraq (free of fundamentalist control) is good for everyone. If a fundamentalist government comes to power, we will have even more issues down the line. Iraq does sit on top of an important resource, so yes they matter to us. I wish they didn’t, but that is just the way it is at this point in time. We are starting to work are way out of there, hopefully it continues.
Please do tell about the “Sarah Palin preaches anti-intellectual cant and divisive hatred”, I haven’t seen it. (seriously)
about 1 year ago
I have to agree that the McCain people have totally blown their campaign, and they don’t have much hope of winning this time around. I don’t really agree with a lot of what McCain has been doing, nor a lot of his policies.
Unfortunately, I also don’t agree with Obama much of the time either. Both of these candidates suck.
Regarding foreign policy, I see McCain as oldschool. He has an idea of handling things as we did in the 50s and 60s, where America basically leaned on everyone it could since it was trying to compete with the USSR.
Obama on the other hand, is the exact opposite. He would run foreign affairs in a way designed to make America more popular internationally, for the sake of making America look more popular. Apparently Obama is all about popularity contests.
Both of these I disagree with.
Regarding the Economy:
I think that the Economy is really a non-issue. The poorest people here in America are still some of the richest people in the world.. so all things considered, things are not that bad. That doesn’t mean that things shouldn’t be fixed, however.
As you have no doubt noticed, people are crazy insane about money. They love money, they want more money.. and this whole “almost kinda recession” thing is eating people’s wallets. We’ve got nothing to worry about here, because our country is chock filled with legions of rich people who want to be richer, and who want to fix the economy so that they can line their own pockets with even more cash.
This isn’t even a political issue. Whoever becomes president will be pressured into doing whatever they can to remedy the situation.
At any rate, regarding the stimulus thing, which you described as “depressingly bipartisan” will, actually work. As you mentioned, it is bipartisan, and it’s bipartisan because everyone’s backed into a corner and there are no other options that will work. Think about it.. who decided to do this stimulus thing? Rich people, that’s who. you think thousands of rich people are doing to shoot themselves in the foot? If there’s one thing that you can expect politicians to do, it’s cover their own butts.
Regarding Taxes:
My income is below 25K per year, I am not married. I pay about 18% of my income in federal taxes. My father, on the other hand, makes around 150-175K per year, and pays over 50% of his income in taxes.
Now we get into “how do you view income?” because at 18% I certainly am not rich, and if I had a family to support? I’d be toast. My dad, however, pays a higher percentage, and even with that takes home over 3 times the amount of cash that I do. He certainly has enough to live on.. so in a sense, he can “afford” a 50% tax rate.
However, I worked my butt off for 100% of my money, and so did my Dad. My 18% doesn’t make much of a difference in my income, but for him, his income is double what he takes home.. essentially half of the work he does isn’t even for his own benefit.
Is my dad rich? He’s certainly well off, but I wouldn’t describe him as rich.
The notion that people who earn more money should pay a higher tax percentage simply because they have deeper pockets is ridiculous.
You mentioned that flat taxes somehow “punish the poor”. Well, I’m poor. Give everyone an 18% tax rate if they make over X amount per year. Is this really that hard to figure out?
The reason that nobody has done this is because it would mean the government rakes in less money per year, which means that politicians can’t throw that money around to buy votes with useless government expendatures.
I think that McCain would attempt to lower my taxes (and I’m not rich). I think that Obama will attempt to raise my taxes. I don’t think either of them would be able to push through a true tax reform that would mean anything.
Regarding Iraq:
How many people does it take to start a war? The answer? More than the president.
People often try to ask “what is the war in Iraq about”. The real answer that nobody wants to admit is “At the time, a lot of people were convinced there were terrorists there, and WMD’s there.” It wasn’t just one guy that said “you hurt my daddy, prepare to die”. It was senators, congressmen, CIA analyists, military intelligence experts.. and if that wasn’t enough, their counterparts in multiple foreign nations who also agreed that “hey, this warrants military action”. These people aren’t stupid, and it cost everyone who participated money.
When we got to Iraq, it turns out that there were, in fact terrorists there.. and there were Biological WMD’s there, but not so nearly as much as we thought, and not the same ones as we thought. In fact, it turns out that this whole Iraq thing probably wasn’t worth the time, effort, and money that we invested on it.
But what about the people in Iraq? We were the ones who kicked over their sand castle. Should we just walk off and leave them then? I don’t think so. We screwed up, we made a mess, and now that we did all that, I don’t think we should just say “oops” and run off. I think that sticking around and helping to rebuild their sandcastle is the right thing to do.. and if we can, we ought to help them build it better than it was before.
Contrary to what people would have you think, the soldiers in Iraq aren’t just there to hunt down bad guys. There is a sizeable portion of the forces there that are repairing bridges, installing water filtration systems for villages, and helping their police keep order.
Is this a cause that American lives should be put at risk for? Now that we made a mess of things already, I say yes.
Regarding Palin:
Does anyone really care about Palin? The McCain campaign obviously picked her strategically to generate more votes for themselves. McCain is seen my hardcore conservatives to be “too liberal” and pulling someone who is more conservative.. especially who is a woman and more conservative is probably a good thing in terms of buying votes. I can’t really fault them there, I mean.. they’re politicians and manipulating people is what they do.
I think you’re right about the republican party being out of touch, but this sort of thing is cyclical. One party stays in, does its thing, and people get fed up with their political BS.. then the other party says “vote for us, we haven’t BS’d you in 8 years!” and so people do.
That’s how Clinton got in office. That’s how George W got in office.. and I’ll bet it’s how Obama gets in office, too. If Obama doesn’t do something stupid in his first 4 years, he’ll win re-election in 4 years, and then the republicans will win the next one after him in 8 years. That’s just how it goes.
about 1 year ago
@84: Obama doesn’t associate with a lot of shady characters, he’s *painted* as associating with a lot of shady characters. He’s a US Senator, and a state legislator before that. The shady characters he associates with are called “lobbyists”. He does not spend his days hanging around the basement of shifty bomb throwers with foreign-sounding names; that’s just the Fox News media narrative and it’s a shameful and insulting one.
A Democratic non-fundamentalist Iraq would be nice. A Democratic non-fundamentalist Saudi Arabia would also be nice. It is not our place to mandate either.
Re: Palin’s anti-intellectualism: her refusal to speak to mainstream media in anything other than the most scripted of settings, her mockery of said media as the “gotcha news media”, her dismissal of any commentary on the issues of today and resorting to “homespun” memorized talking points, her frankly ridiculous performance in the VP debate where she spent her time veering wildly off topic to maintain said memorized talking points while winking – *winking* – into the camera, and most notably and most troubling, her recent campaign rallies where she has whipped up a McCarthyite fervor against her electoral opponents, not based on issues but on a thin strand of associations as proof that her opponents are literally terrorists who hate America.
about 1 year ago
@85: “I think that McCain would attempt to lower my taxes”
No, he would not. The tax plan McCain proposes contains minimal (~$50) cuts for your bracket.
http://www.electiontaxes.com/ – non-partisan comparison of both plans.
about 1 year ago
Scott: I agree about the lobbyists of course. No one says he hangs around plotting with them. But I’m not sure how you can deny he has a relationship with Ayers. They worked together, Ayers even gave a little party for Obama at the start of his political careers. They are not best friends, but they are not strangers either. There is also the preacher at his church, the convicted Rezco and now this PLO debacle with the LA Times (which I don’t know enough to speak on yet, so it could be nothing).
Of course Fox is biased, just like other outlets. That doesn’t mean the above never took place does it?
Well, we did topple the Iraqi Government already, so we shouldn’t leave them hanging.
I’m not sure what to say to you about Palin, as you ignore most of those same issues in the candidates of your choice. The last sentence though, Ayers was (is? Once a terrorist always a terrorist? When does it expire?) an admitted terrorist. As is known, they were friendly (i.e. pals). Do you put on functions for complete strangers?
So her statement while inflammatory (and unnecessary) is not false. So I agree and disagree with you on that.
about 1 year ago
Scott: I am enjoying the actual non-flaming political talk. Yay for that
about 1 year ago
The association with Ayers is completely irrelevant. Completely irrelevant. Ayers is currently a professor at the University of Illinois. Should students not attend his classes for fear that they are associating with a terrorist? Just a brief reading of Ayers wiki page should give you a clue, this is not a dude who is out planting bombs, he is now a respected citizen of Chicago. Should everyone shun him now because of what happened forty years ago? And the fact that Obama had a brief association with him is supposed to disqualify him from being president? It’s totally ridiculous. Just a totally ridiculous political smokescreen McCain’s campaign farted out in desperation.
about 1 year ago
If we’re going to bring up the whole Ayers thing as if it’s relevant, let’s reexamine that McCain-Keating connection again. Guild by association, sure, McCain’s got his hands in the S&L mess AND the current set of fuck ups, and then chooses to make a blood relative of Keating’s brother-in-law is such a prominent figure. Yeah, that’s just who we want taking care of things.
Or did you all miss that’s who “Joe the Plumber” is?
about 1 year ago
“Should students not attend his classes for fear that they are associating with a terrorist?”
I don’t think the Ayers, et al. connection has been brought up to spook people into thinking Obama will encourage washed-up weekend revolutionaries to run around planting bombs, but as a counterpoint to any attempts by his campaign to paint him as a moderate or centrist, given that many of his associates in Chicago were well to the left of the Democratic Party. (And also because the similar attack on Wright was probably the only one that left a mark, albeit temporary, on Obama’s campaign.)
about 1 year ago
Scott, Barr is primarily a fiscal conservative.
Here are some of the facts:
http://www.ontheissues.org/Senate/Barack_Obama.htm
http://www.ontheissues.org/Senate/John_McCain.htm
http://www.ontheissues.org/GA/Bob_Barr.htm
Interesting Obama supported Charter schools (but not a vote). If he support school vouchers and vote yes on $40B in reduced federal overall spending, I would actually vote for him.
And thanks for your calculator, Obama would save me some tax money too.
However I disagree with you on redistribution of wealth.
See my link. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Income_tax_in_the_United_States
The original income tax is for people who make over $4000/year, of the richest 10% of people. Now it is on all of us!! Your 120k/year will be 240k easily in the next 15 years.
But the most important thing is this. If this government is clean, where the tax dollars are truely used to help us, a little tax is nothing. However did you notice where the money went? It is used to build bridges to no where, measure how long rat’s tails are, making banks that does not fear of losing money (Fannie and Fredi). Most of us, rich or poor, gets our wealth through hard work. What right does the politicians has to waste them on pork?
about 1 year ago
I recently read Richard K. Morgan “Thirteen”, very enjoyable sci-fiction book that touched in great detail on what American political future might be. I highly recommend it just because of that.
about 1 year ago
Oh and 1…2…3…4 until Obama’s landslide victory and prompt assassination.
about 1 year ago
The Ayers thing is a smokescreen. Even Chicago Republicans said it was a non-issue.
about 1 year ago
Regarding campaign-promised effects on taxes:
You said that McCain wouldn’t lower my taxes, and then you state that his plan would, in fact, lower my taxes.. and then you give a website that proves that McCain would lower my taxes.
Truth be told, I’d be okay with a drop in my tax rate, but as it is, I can handle the current tax rate. I certainly don’t want it to go up, which according to that same website, my taxes wil go up nearly $200 with Obama’s plan.
So, according to your own sources, McCain gives me $50 back, and Obama charges me $200 more than present.
If we were only considering taxes, my vote would be sold on the guy who doesn’t want to take more of my money.
I don’t know what the real thinking is behind Obama’s plan. I’m not the very lowest bracket, so that must mean that I can afford to shell out more cash to a government that can’t use it effectively.
There really is nothing quite so bothersome as a group of rich people deciding how much of my money they should take out of my pocket and put into their own.
about 1 year ago
Are there two Klaitus in this thread? At post 85, you said “My income is below 25K per year, I am not married.” … when I plug that in at the link Scott provided, you pay about $500 more under McCain’s plan. If I put in an additional 28k or so per year from long term cap gains, then I can get close to you paying more. If you’re making 28k per year from long term cap gains in this market, you should be advising people – or you have a few million in some fund somewhere. But yes, in the end no matter who is president this 10.5 trillion bill will need to be paid, and it’ll have to be paid with taxes. Since the beginning of September the nat’l debt has increased 880 billion (thanks, TARP!). China, Japan, and the Middle East will want to be paid back eventually (talk about compromising national security….. what better way to do it than put our financial future in their hands!).
about 1 year ago
“It is deeply frightening for anyone with a sense of history, and the Republican campaign has been extremely irresponsible in its prosceution of the campaign and its consequent corrosion of the national dialogue. I disagree with many people politically – this does not mean they are Insert-scary-meaningless-word-here.”
You can’t seriously argue that the “corrosion of the national dialogue” is a *consequence* of the Republican 2008 presidential campaign. Or perhaps you’ve just missed some pretty corrosive words, images, and actions lobbed by the other side over the past several years. I’d agree that American political discourse is in the toilet, but it didn’t start with Governor Palin saying Senator Obama could have picked his friends better. Your dropping of the four-letter “N” word, and the 7.6 million google responses to “Bush is a Nazi”, are ironic.
We’re overly politicized in this country, and the internet, 24 hour news cycle, and having only two political parties exacerbates things. If I suspected Barack Obama was capable of being the post-partisan as he was once presented, that would be reason enough to vote for him. But he’s not and has no history of reaching across the aisle. There was a rush to delegitimize and villify Bush and Cheyney even before 9/11, and it’s naieve to expect better treatment of Obama. This is what we are now, and it’s not the fault of one side or the other.
And what does any of this have to do with…
about 1 year ago
Dammit, I can’t believe this hasn’t yet broken down to the point where I can start posting youtube links to videos of rednecks saying Obama is a terrorist because of his middle name.
You people are too mature for your own damn good.
A pox upon you.
And our enemies will celebrate all over the world.
about 1 year ago
100 comments on politics? Impressive.
I wrote a tldr essay on the eve of the Iraq war, opposing it because of its false pretext. I never sent it. Ultimately, paying the families of suicide bombers $1500 is something that the free world should curtail. Even if it simply comes down to how your culture defines the word “Martyr”.
I find great ironic humor in the debate about energy. McCain says the solution is more nuclear power. In that he is in lockstep with Ahmadinejad and Kim Jong-il, who desire the same for their people. Almost as ironic as when his party abolished the MLK holiday in Arizona, which got the governor of the time impeached.
about 1 year ago
I think, personally, that biscuits and gravy are pretty tasty.
about 1 year ago
Re “guilt by association” — doesn’t this smack of McCarthyism?
Re Palin: Some Assembly of God acquaintances not only believe McCain will win, but they are actually praying he dies before taking office so that their beloved Sarah can step in as President immediately.
If so, I’m re-reading Richard Morgan’s Thirteen. It may be science fiction today, but truth tomorrow.
about 1 year ago
Not that American citizens should be overly influenced by this, but when the rest of the world is hoping you pick Obama, I think it should still count for something…
As a Canadian, I truly hope you guys pick Obama. McCain seems way too volatile, ignorant, and triggy-happy for me. It’s kind of funny… I’ve been following your presidential campaign much more than I followed our recent federal elections. I’m quite sure your next president will have a larger impact on my country than my own government. Obama will be better for both of us.
I also hope he has the best security detail on the planet if he becomes your next president. There are a lot of crazies out there…
about 1 year ago
All I know is that pre-existing conditions must be torn from the Health Insurance play book. If a man or woman goes without a job/health insurance in America for more than 62 days they and their family members forever get the pre-existing rider on all future health insurance. That’s bullshit.
about 1 year ago
Sounds very similar to my opinions. I was actually for Hilary, then when she missed it, was for McCain, due to his experience. Palin’s selection shook me, and her complete lack of knowledge of…well anything, sent me to Obama’s camp. The continued and increasingly negative campaigning done by the side (not that Obama’s camp is in any way innocent) really keeps me from listening to them anymore. It sounds, to me, more like a hate rally than a political rally, and I’m hoping that McCain realizes at some point that he’s going a bit too far. Palin at this point has gone so far into crazyland that she’s as close to being an animated character as William Shatner. The reason that the SNL bits are so funny is that she is really like that. Palin is the most popular costume this year.
Neither of the choices are saints, neither are a perfect fit, but given a choice between the two, I feel that Obama is closer to what I want to see.
about 1 year ago
Is the “Palin” costume really the most popular one for Halloween this year? You realize what that means, right?
If the Halloween-mask prediction comes true again (like it has for almost every past Election-year Halloween), that’s a sure fire sign of a Republican victory.
about 1 year ago
On the economy and taxes, and the affects of taxes, and this is very important.
Everyone talks about our deficit, and Bush’s tax cuts. Here’s the facts.
Bush’s tax cuts removed $75 billion of tax burden to the people.
However, tax revenues that the government took in in 2006 were $47 billion more than what was projected to happen before the tax cuts were implemented. The projections are the only fair way to look at it, as the population grows.
The reason for this is simple. Tax rates and taxable incomes are two different things. Higher tax rates reduce investment, thus reducing jobs, thus reducing taxable incomes. Lower tax rates do just the opposite.
Capital Gains are also important in the same way.
In 2003, capital gains tax rates were reduced from 20 percent and 10 percent (depending on income) to 15 percent and 5 percent. Rather than expand by 36 percent from the current $50 billion level to $68 billion in 2006 as projected before the tax cut, capital gains revenues more than doubled to $103 billion. And past capital gains tax cuts have shown similar results.
The problem with our deficit wasn’t because we were taking in less tax revenue, in fact we were taking in allot more. The problem was that we were spending a whole lot more. But I fail to see why people want to blame Bush, or anyone for that matter, for this. Look at what we were spending on, and for. We were in two wars, but importantly, we were rebuilding our entire defensive structure within our country to fight terrorist attacks. Allot of money has been spent in our airports, seaports, and cities for detection and prevention. We’ve restructured our intelligence capabilities at home and around the world. I can’t even find figures on the amounts spent because this is massive, and spread out between many agencies and departments, nationally and internationally, state wide, and local.
(And for those who still think the war in Iraq was wrong, I’ve already posted above the reasons why we had to invade.)
Wars cost allot of money. And make no mistake about it, we are in a massive war that includes all of the above and more. But we are winning, and we will win, as we must.
Obama’s tax plans, not even considering that he wants to just pull out of Iraq and hand it over to our enemies, would do the opposite of what has happened under Bush’s tax cuts. It would hurt investment and growth, thus hurting jobs, thus hurting taxable incomes.
The arguments on socialism and redistribution of wealth are wrong. We are doing that now! If you file a tax return, and if you get more refunds than what you owe in taxes, you get refunded more than you paid in taxes. That argument is pure politics. But that’s the way it is, they all do it, because they all have to do it to get elected. Ignore it! Concentrate instead on the facts and the ramifications of their policies.
about 1 year ago
Normally, I do not discuss politics on my MMO blog or on other MMO blogs. I am secure in my political beliefs. I don’t feel the need to convert others or preach to the converted as a way to boost my self-esteem. However, today I’d like to make an exception and address some of the exaggerations and deceptions contained in this article.
First off, you are no conservative Scott. Anyone that would cast a vote for the most liberal member of the U.S. Senate and the most liberal Presidential candidate in the history of America is most certainly not a conservative. Claiming to be the opposite of what you believe is one of the oldest tricks in the book and hopefully most readers didn’t fall for it.
“Culture, Palin, and thought: The last point is something that the Republican party has to face if it will survive the next decade: among many other ill-concieved decisions, in embracing Sarah Palin and the social conservatism that she represents, the Republican party has made itself the standard bearer for anti-intellectualism.”
I detect thinly veiled snobbery here and contempt for people who happen to hold traditional values. In your world, only people that are fortunate enough to attend an Ivy League university are qualified to be vice-president or president of the USA. Being a good leader is far more then being an intellectual, it’s about having character — something that narcissistic Obama will never have despite his debonair charm and teleprompter eloquence. Sarah Palin never set out to be a presidential or vice-presidential candidate. For some citizens, political office is about service instead of grabbing power. To her credit she was minding her own business and the business of the people of Alaska when John McCain asked her to be his running mate. Meanwhile, Barry Obama’s entire life has always been in the pursuit of activities and associations that would pad his resume and further his rise to power.
“Sarah Palin, as best as anyone can tell, has no opinions. On anything. In her few unscripted interviews, she has been unable to answer such simple questions as what newspaper she reads in the morning.
Do you know Sarah Palin personally? If not, then how do you know she has no opinions? Have you lived in Alaska while she was the Governor? How on earth did she get elected having “no opinions”? How did she fight corruption in Alaska and take on her own party without having an opinion? How did she get an 80% approval rating in Alaska with “no opinions”? You, on the other hand, Scott the Blogger seemingly have lots of expert opinions on many subjects and surely that makes you qualified to be vice-president right? The truth is that Sarah Palin has lots of opinions — you just don’t happen to agree with any of them.
Never before in the history of politics has a vice-presidential candidate been the victim of such a concentrated campaign of hate and smears as Sarah Palin. (Oh I must have missed your clever blog entries about how offended you were about the effigy of Sarah Palin hanging from the noose in West Hollywood or how unfunny comedian Sarah Bernhardt suggested that Sarah Palin should be gang raped by African American men.)I doubt you or any of your crew on this thread hiding behind their monitors would survive 5 minutes of the kind of insults or scrutiny that she and her family has faced.
“Yet Palin’s, and McCain’s response to the very simple questions raised by Palin’s lack of intellectual curiosity is to attack those who ask the questions, and moreover, to attack the very question itself. “Joe Sixpack” or “Joe the Plumber” wouldn’t ask if Sarah Palin has a foreign policy beyond a woolly grasp of geography.”
In 1992 a young and previously unknown governor of the State of Arkansas named Bill Clinton become the President. According to a recent interview with one of his advisors Dick Morris, he had ZERO foreign policy experience when he got elected. Morris said that it took Clinton about a year to get up to speed on foreign policy after entering the White House. Governor Sarah Palin from all accounts is also a very quick study. Given your logic a governor of any state in the USA would be automatically disqualified from being the President because they lack any substantive foreign policy experience. By the way, sixteen U.S. presidents were state governors before holding the highest office in the land. Thankfully the American people know better and exhibit much more of an open-minded approach regarding the experience of who they support for president.
On the subject of foreign policy, you fail to mention who has the true deficit of experience: Barack Obama. I find it interesting how you conveniently forgot to mention that Obama totally fumbled his initial response to the Russian invasion of Georgia and demonstrated a shocking naivete of how the UN Security Council veto power works. That’s inexcusable for someone who wants to be leading the free world. You also failed to mention the many gaffs that Joe Biden has made regarding foreign policy including his plan to partition Iraq and his feeling that Obama’s inexperience will in essence be an open door for him to be “tested”. Here’s one of his infamous gaffs:
“When the stock market crashed, Franklin D. Roosevelt got on the television and didn’t just talk about the, you know, the princes of greed,” Biden told the CBS Evening News on Sept. 22.
The facts: Herbert Hoover was president in October 1929 when the stock market crashed. FDR wasn’t elected until 1932, and television made its debut a decade later, in 1939.
Katie Couric conveniently failed to pursue Biden on this gaff. And you are worried about Sarah Palin’s lack of foreign policy experience? At least she’s not a bumbling oaf like Biden.
Now back to Joe the Plumber. Here we have a guy who happened to be throwing a football with his son on a Ohio street where Obama was walking down and (read: looking for an easy photo-op) and asks a simple question and now suddenly he’s the bad guy for daring to ask a question? The very next day Obama mocked and laughed at Joe the Plumber at a rally. This guy’s life has been turned upside down by vicious attacks by their cohorts in the left-wing media and now by Democratic state officials. The media even had satellite trucks parked outside his home — not terrorist Bill Ayers home though. In reality it’s the Obama campaign who has been using ad hominem attacks on people who ask the uncomfortable questions. Joe the Plumber soon learned what happens to you when you question the “change we need”.
“Instead they would go to political gatherings strongly, horribly reminiscent of Nazi Germany’s Nuremburg rallies to rail at their enemies for being terrorists and socialists and Arabs and the other. Literally. Raising the Republican bogeymen, much as Jews were for the Nazis – no actual meaning, simply the other to scare the faithful with in lieu of an actual reasonable dialogue. This is not merely troubling. It is deeply frightening for anyone with a sense of history, and the Republican campaign has been extremely irresponsible in its prosceution of the campaign and its consequent corrosion of the national dialogue. I disagree with many people politically – this does not mean they are Insert-scary-meaningless-word-here.”
That is one of the worst examples of fear-mongering that I’ve read so far during this election. The above assertions are baseless and groundless. As a so-called student of history, you should be ashamed of yourself for publishing such false tripe. Equating people who vote for John McCain and the Republican party with Nazi Germany is a clear sign of desperation and immaturity on your part. Your ego must be huge if you think you could escape the invocation of Godwin’s Law.
“This is not occurring in a vacuum. It is part of a pattern shown by today’s Republican leaders and the current Administration – a lack of respect for dissent, an all too easy appeal to fear and the other – sadly made all too easy, and all too quickly exploited, by the 9/11 attacks. If you ask many people today if Saddam Hussein bore responsibility for 9/11, many would say yes.”
Please provide some concrete and verifiable examples where this administration has impinged upon the rights of Americans to exercise free speech or squelched dissent? That’s right, you can’t. In fact the lack of dissent can be found in the left — within the Democratic Party who won’t allow debates on most votes in Congress, the left-wing biased mainstream media and the political correct academia on most university campuses. It is the Democrats who are opposed to dissent as they are considering reinstating the so-called Fairness Doctrine in an effort to silence talk radio — the only medium that the left has failed to utterly dominate and control. Why? Because it’s the only medium left outside of the Internet where the average American (you know those uneducated, unintelligent, socially conservative dolts who don’t have blogs — that you seem to despise) have a voice.
“Our government, in this as in so many other ways, has simply failed us. It has devolved to primitive threats of fear and anti-intellectual rejection of reason, something cheered on by the shock-talk conservative partisan media. And we see its application in the McCain campaign and its apparent existence in a strange time continuum where William Ayers is responsible for the stock market collapse and Barack Obama is an Arab terrorist.”
I agree the government has failed us on many fronts — especially their involvement in precipitating and managing the current financial crisis. However it has not failed us for the reasons you state. Some Americans are rightfully afraid about the candidacy of Barrack Obama because they know so little about him due to the negligence of the mainstream media who is desperate to get him elected. Obama has failed to release many details about his past to the public and lied about his associations.
Even one of the top reporters for the L.A. Times (a liberal newspaper) recently admitted that Obama is largely inaccessible and essentially a mystery to the press. If only the mainstream media had put the same scrutiny on Barrack Obama as they have done on Sarah Palin this would not be an issue and Americans would be able to make an informed choice. Don’t blame people for being afraid of someone they do not know especially when that person is seeking the most important job in the world.
Please provide some evidence where a legitimate news organization or any serious conservative thinker/pundit has claimed that Ayers caused the stock market problems. That is patently false. Nobody of any import or influence believes that Obama is an Arab terrorist. Please stop making straw man fallacies as you are embarrassing yourself.
Granted, George Bush in many ways has been a less then competent president. Let’s be honest, the current Democratic congress has the lowest approval ratings of any congress in the history of the USA — lower then the current approval ratings of George Bush. As far as fear is concerned, aren’t you a hypocrite? You just finished stoking the flames of fear by equating McCain supporters and Republicans with Nazi Germany but then you are indignant that the media and the American public have no right to be afraid of a candidate that went to a racist church for 20 years and who associates with known terrorist spokespersons such as Khalidi and unrepentant terrorists like Ayers? If John McCain and the Oklahoma City bomber Timothy McVeigh went to the same racist church together wouldn’t you be at all concerned? You damned right you’d be concerned and rightfully so.
“This must be confronted. It must be rejected. We as Americans are simply better than this, and we must show this, cleanly and clearly. The appeals to fear and horror must be rejected.”
You are right. Scott, you are much better then this. Your absurd appeal equating McCain and the Republicans to the horrors of Nazi Germany is embarrassingly juvenile and amateurish. Making the case for Obama by writing a respectful and dignified article is one thing, but reaching into the gutter like this and smearing your fellow Americans with such mean-spirited language is completely unacceptable and should be rejected. It’s a sad day for the MMO blogosphere when Lum the Mad finally lives up to his name.
about 1 year ago
Here here, Scott. I commend you on your ability to step back from one’s own political biases and make decisions with clarity. And here’s to hoping that if in the future the tables are reversed and it is the Democratic Party guilty of such malfeasance I shall be able to follow your lead.
about 1 year ago
Sorry, one other thing… I keep hearing people repeat, as both McCain and wolfshead have done, that Obama is the most “liberal Presidential candidate in the history of America.” O, Eugene Debs, has your memory faded so quickly?
about 1 year ago
The funny thing is, according to the polls (as given by TV network news) is that people think that Obama is more likely to do the right thing vis a vis the economy. This is absurd. There isn’t a ghost of a chance that either candidate will “do the right thing” because they, like most politicos, are still in the thrall of John Maynard Keynes–not surprising, since his theory encourages them to take control of economic resources. (Before anybody jumps in to argue about Keynesian economic theory, consider that Keynes personally invested using the “castles in the air” or “greater fool” method. Somebody’s got to eat that loss at the end.)
All the arguing done is about taxes, but taxes are really less than half the story. The bulk of the problem has to do with spending, and not just government spending but also the spending of the private sector–a problem effectively created by forcing the interest rate. I personally think that allowing the interest rate to move back towards the actual time preference rate of the market would go a long way towards alleviating our economic problems–the savings rate would rise, the present value of many forms of government bonds would decline, thus giving the opportunity to clear our existing debt more cheaply, and it will become more expensive for the government to raise money, hopefully restraining spending.
about 1 year ago
James: Sadly, (or more likely not, from the average American’s standpoint) yes. The United States just wasn’t sufficiently fertile ground for socialist parties.
about 1 year ago
Well put. Thank you Scott!
about 1 year ago
Speaking of accusations of a “lack of respect for dissent”, The Obama campaign has kicked the reporters of 3 publications off their campaign plane, supposedly to make room for others. The thing they all have in common? That their papers have decided to support McCain.
That brings to mind WFTV and news reporter Barbara West, who challenged Joe Biden recently, and was rewarded with a cancellation of future interviews.
Which in turn brings to mind the planned boycotting of Fox News some months ago, which fell through because most people in fact watch them.
about 1 year ago
> That brings to mind WFTV and news reporter Barbara West,
> who challenged Joe Biden recently, and was rewarded with
> a cancellation of future interviews.
She didn’t “challenge” Joe Biden, she gave what might be one of the most mind-blowingly partisanly stupid interviews in recent memory. She literally asked Biden if Obama was actually a Marxist (which caused Biden to literally perform a double take).
Don’t take my word for it, judge for yourself. It’s funny.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TW_wQgWviZ8
about 1 year ago
Scott, the accusations were already out there. It didn’t used to be uncommon for interviewers to ask the questions to allow the interviewee to respond to them.
about 1 year ago
He’s been accused of being the Antichrist also, you’ll note that she didn’t ask about that. Seriously there are sensible questions based on legitimate issues and then there are loaded ‘So do you still beat your wife?’ type stuff. Those questions do not warrant dignifying with a response.
The recent rash of foamy-chinned tinfoil hat nonsense coming from the right (as exemplified by Wolfshead and others in this thread) is indicative of how little actual substance they possess. No-one is arguing about John McCain’s policies or his stance on anything substantive because the right wing commentators are painfully aware that there is nothing to discuss. Instead we get increasingly desperate attempts to hang increasingly weak and increasingly misrepresented ‘scandals’ on the other guy.
about 1 year ago
“Too bad we were raised by government schools that told us we had only two choices.”
*Math* tells us we have only two choices. The two party system is the result of trivial optimization of winner-take-all. Barring a change to our election systems, it’s inevitable.
about 1 year ago
Wolfshead: Wow, I don’t have the time or the patience to go through your post line by line as you did Scott’s to paint you as the brainwashed Republican tool you so obviously are, but I do give you props for the almost Fox News-like rebuttal to what Scott posted. Perhaps you should work for them. But, in short:
- Sarah Palin is an idiot. Plain and simple. Anybody who argues to the contrary simply makes a fool of themselves. She got elected in Alaska because 1. Alaska likes their women (even family sometimes *wink* *wink*). 2. She’s sexy (to Alaskans?).
- Joe the Plumber is a fake. He has been a regular on Ohio conservative radio shows for years now. If you haven’t read any of what has been revealed about him in the last couple weeks, you need to watch something other than Fox News.
- Obama “inaccessible”? Gee, you would think someone who wrote an auto-biography wouldn’t have much more to hide. Bill Ayers? The man was an anti-war protester, not a terrorist. A lot of people said a lot of things about the US Government back then. Saying you’ll do something and never following through does not make you a terrorist, it makes you a hot head. Terrorists, on the other hand, actually do some pretty awful things and rarely are they preceded with clear warnings.
Frankly, I am shocked that someone clearly as intelligent as you could be hoodwinked into towing the Republican line. There are only four reasons why anyone would still be in the Republican tank:
1. Older generation (60+).
2. Social conservatism (Hates gays).
3. Ignorance (What newspaper do YOU read?).
4. Rich and Greedy (You must be Rupert Murdoch!).
Choose any two. Which are you?
about 1 year ago
@Tem,
I am none of that 4, but I am not voting Obama.
To of my older friends, both 60+, social conservative (against gay marriage), Rich (Greedy if you call want to make a profile greedy), insisted voting on Obama.
They actually agree with my views of smaller government and people should be responsible for themselves. The only reason they are voting for Obama is hating Bush
So far all the friends who can vote I have talked to (2 McCain 2 Obama), only 1 McCain voter agreed with me and voted Barr. The 3 guys who won’t change all cited that Barr will not win as the reason.
about 1 year ago
People telling me I’m not allowed to call myself a conservative any more never gets old. (Ignore the fact that so many conservatives are endorsing Obama this year that Colbert did a joke on it.) Maybe we can come up with a new label instead. I hear “whig” is free.
I went to a commuter college in north Florida (and never finished, at that) so I suppose I hold myself in contempt as well? Methinks you are projecting a bit too much. At any rate, I have no problem with people who hold traditional values (such as, oh, I don’t know, myself). People who try to impose traditional values I tend to disagree with.
How dare our leaders be well-spoken and thoughtful!
This is inaccurate. She sought out to (and did) impress the editors of the National Review and Weekly Standard a few years back during their yearly Alaska cruises with an eye towards a place on the national ticket.
Yes, he’s an ambitious politician. HOLY CRAP STOP THE PRESSES, CINCINNATUS ISN’T RUNNING THIS YEAR.
Through her writings, speeches, and interviews. How do you know anything about anyone you don’t personally know?
Because she’s young, attractive, and not Frank Murkowski.
Unlike Ms. Palin, I am well aware of my lack of qualification for high political office.
Yes, normally Karl Rove’s operatives concentrate on the top of the ticket.
I find this highly amusing given the abuse I’ve personally suffered being a visible figure in the MMO community over the past decade, including death threats, obscene photoshops, angry Geocities hate sites, drunken people ranting at me in bars in person, and the occasional indecipherable screaming about “Trammel”. Admittedly this does not compare to the fury of Alec Baldwin waxing wroth on the Huffington Post, but it still is, I note, highly amusing.
Bill Clinton did not avoid the national media out of fear of actually having to answer questions. Sarah Palin does. And from all accounts within her campaign (note: *within her own campaign*) she is anything but a quick study, but instead is a ‘diva’ and ‘whack job’ who was so unprepared she was kept from the media out of a sense of preservation. (Note that those quotes are not from the Obama campaign, but from the *McCain* campaign.)
I find it interesting that you apparently think “the Russian invasion of Georgia” is a clear cut case of Russian aggression that Obama “fumbled”, when in point of fact it is entirely arguable that Georgia provoked the attack though indiscriminate rocket shelling of Tshkinvali (the S. Ossetian capital). I also find it interesting that you apparently think Russian intervention into a former Soviet state in the Caucasus is worth taking the US into war with Russia over. I also wonder if you, like McCain, actually are aware of the history of post-Soviet successor states (which, including Georgia, are far from paragons of democracy) or if you are simply parroting neoconservative talking points.
You are aware Iraq is already de facto partitioned largely through American fiat, correct? That Kurdistan is a de facto independent state, which is not a de jure independent state only due to Turkish sensitivity regarding their own Kurdish minority, and that the US military has been funding Sunni “Awakening” militias ostensibly to protect themselves from al’Qaeda in Iraq (which is effectively wiped out as a military force) but in reality to protect themselves from the Medhi Army militas, SCIRI, and other Shi’ite militias that in effect run the Iraqi central government? I mean, I wouldn’t want to assume that you were speaking out of ignorance on Iraq and judging Biden’s proposed recognition of reality on the ground based on that. Or that, again, you would merely be parroting someone else’s talking points instead of doing your own research on the subject.
No, she is entirely her own brand of bumbling, you are correct there.
That would explain why Wurzelbacher is a long-time figure in Ohio conservative talk radio who plans to run for political office. It’s all the Democrats’ fault, picking on a poor innocent plumber! It’s not like McCain has made him a keystone of his campaign or anything.
Equating people who demand Obama’s execution as a terrorist with the sort of rhetoric heard in Weimar-era fascist rallies is entirely appropriate, given that the propaganda techniques involved (demonization of the ‘other’, nationalist resentment over percieved social injustice) is identical.
Oh good lord, where do I start? Patriot Act, oversight-free wiretaps, search and seizure of laptops at the border being so bad businesses literally instruct travellers not to take them through customs any more… oh, you mean actually impinging on free speech? Here you go: http://www.aclu.org/freespeech/protest/silenced.html
I agree with you that trying to re-impose the Fairness Doctrine would be a mistake. So does Barack Obama.
Obama has written two autobiographies. Perhaps you want him to write more?
The constant attempts by the right-wing media to conflate Obama and Bill Ayers are ridiculous and serve solely to use the words “Obama” and “terrorist” in the same sentence. This is not “rightfully afraid”, this is manipulation via base propaganda.
Barack Obama has been almost impossible to avoid in the media. He has given hundreds if not thousands of interviews, among them to some very hostile questioners. Yet apparently the right wing media is fond of insisting that “we just don’t KNOW about Obama” – are Obama’s beliefs somehow hidden? I mean, there’s a whole website full of them, with his name right there in the URL. It certainly couldn’t be because the right wing media is appealing to fear of Obama’s foreign sounding name and implying that he is somehow a Muslim and that means he’s evil and a terrorist (because all Muslims are evil and terrorist simply by virtue of being Muslim), correct? Certainly they wouldn’t be implying that, they simply want to know what Obama stands for, right? So by that logic, I can only conclude that the right-wing media is incapable of using a web browser.
It’s an ironic joke based on that the McCain campaign found Bill Ayers’ history more worthy of discussion than the collapse of the financial system.
Let’s be honest, the Democrats have held power in Congress for less than 2 years. But, hey, clearly the problems in this country are all their fault – if only the Republicans had had two more years of uncontested political control, everything would be *fine*!
What are you actually trying to say here? That Obama isn’t what he advertises himself to be – namely an unrepentant liberal Senator from Illinois – and is some sort of Manchurian candidate that is going to turn over the country to Hamas and the Black Panthers? Leaving aside the casual dismissal of Obama’s religion as a “racist church” (because only whites are allowed to attend politically active ministries, apparently) and McCain and Palin both being linked to ministers who have said things equally as vile as Wright – what exactly are you trying to say? Is it not enough to vote against Obama because he’s liberal? Because that at least would be intellectually honest. Calling him out on his links with Rezko and crony Chicago politics – again, a fair cop, and something Obama should do a better job of explaining himself on.
But trying to paint Obama literally as a terrorist by his attending a dinner here and a party there with people that we should *fear* as the *other* (despite neither Khalidi nor Ayers actually being, you know, criminals)? That is not fair political discourse, it is guilt by association, leveraged by fear of someone who is feared for being a different race and ethnicity from the speaker and the spoken. Which is not just McCarthyism, but also an appeal to racist fear.
And you’re damn right, I will *not* meekly accept that.
about 1 year ago
Yep, Obama actually don’t support fairness doctrine http://www.broadcastingcable.com/article/CA6573406.html?desc=topstory, that one alone made him that better than Hillary.
It is the “Russian invasion of Georgia” issues that made me go for Barr.
McCain jumped right on blaming Russia. Obama’s “For MANY months, I have warned …” talk is laughable too (source http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/08/11/obama-responds-to-conflic_n_118276.html)
It is interesting the republican who I can’t convince to vote for Barr thinks just like McCain….
about 1 year ago
I mean on the Russian/Georgia issue
about 1 year ago
About Khalidi: Apparently he’s a PLO spokesman although he’s often been critical of the PLO and neither he nor the PLO have ever claimed any association – in fact both parties have at different times denied any involvement.
He is a professor of Arab studies, sat on the board of a Republican-funded institute for research in Middle-Eastern studies, he is a member of a multifaith organisation of Jews, Christians and Muslims dedicated to dialogue and advocacy regarding the Arab-Israeli conflict and is probably the leading Middle Eastern scholar in America today. Basically the kind of person that anyone with an interest in the area should be talking to. He’s also very much involved in education reform – which has always been one of Obama’s hobby-horses.
But yeah, he’s brown and has a funny name so that makes him a terrorist obviously.
about 1 year ago
In the McCain campaign’s defense, regarding the “collapse” of the “financial system,” they were really in a damned if you do, damned if you don’t situation. The Republicans are considered responsible by virtue of the fact that they had the White House, rather than because something they did (differently, anyway) explicitly caused the “crisis.” When faced with a choice between “taking responsibility” for something you didn’t really do or appearing to be petulant liars for disclaiming responsibility… it’s not really surprising that they tried to change the subject.
about 1 year ago
Ya know, this is a great post. Period. I’ve been struggling to put into words just how to explain the tone and character of the Republican rally cry, but the last section of your post bears it out quite eloquently.
What’s truly troubling, and you didn’t touch on this, is how close the race is between Obama and McCain. Here’s part of the problem. People, in general, are pretty dumb. Here’s a few things I’ve heard, unsolicited, out of people where I live here in suburban Chicago:
“Obama supports gay marriage, which means they would be teaching that to our children in school!”
“Obama is a Muslim, therefore he supports terrorism”
“Obama is a Communist”
This is the kind of stuff I’ve been hearing and unfortunately, for these people, there’s obviously no ability to reason logically with them since apparently they’re intellectually void. This is the kind of blind, mindless sheep mentality that saw Bush to a second term. As you’ll recall, they battle cry on ’04 was “we gotta win the war against terrorism”! Of course, no one at that point had any obvious point of reference since the mainstream news media hadn’t clued in yet that Iraq had effectively nothing to do with the current domestic terrorist problem, so all they had to go by was the rhetoric from both parties, and the American people put their money on “the devil you know” spot, without any consideration for any of the other domestic problems we faced at that time. Unfortunately, the American people have only partially awakened to the notion that closing your eyes and wishing something to go away doesn’t make it actually go away. The only action that seemed to make sense at the time was to move a Democratic majority to the Hill, but all that did was grind the Federal Government to a complete halt for the last 2 years. If for nothing else, at least if Obama makes it into office, SOMETHING will get done!
about 1 year ago
With the passage of Pelosi’s stimulus package, the appointment of a man apparently too stupid to use turbotax to head the IRS and moving of the census to white house control I certainly hope you all are happy.